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White Spaces!....



 
 
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  #1  
Old April 3rd 13, 12:02 PM posted to uk.tech.broadcast,alt.radio.digital,uk.tech.digital-tv
tony sayer
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Posts: 5,001
Default White Spaces!....


Looks like more of the UHF broadcast band might be compromised;!...

http://www.cambridgewireless.co.uk/d...20Spaces%20Tri
al%20-%20technical%20findings-with%20higher%20res%20pics.pdf
--
Tony Sayer

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  #2  
Old April 3rd 13, 03:36 PM posted to uk.tech.broadcast,alt.radio.digital,uk.tech.digital-tv
Richard Evans[_2_]
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Posts: 214
Default White Spaces!....

On 03/04/2013 13:02, tony sayer wrote:

Looks like more of the UHF broadcast band might be compromised;!...

http://www.cambridgewireless.co.uk/d...20Spaces%20Tri
al%20-%20technical%20findings-with%20higher%20res%20pics.pdf

I've only briefly skimmed through that document, but it could be a bit
of a worry, as there would always be the potential fro things to go
wrong, and allow interference to peoples TV reception.

Richard E.
  #3  
Old April 3rd 13, 06:19 PM posted to uk.tech.broadcast,alt.radio.digital,uk.tech.digital-tv
[email protected]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 1,245
Default White Spaces!....

On Wed, 03 Apr 2013 16:36:55 +0100, Richard Evans
wrote:

On 03/04/2013 13:02, tony sayer wrote:

Looks like more of the UHF broadcast band might be compromised;!...

http://www.cambridgewireless.co.uk/d...20Spaces%20Tri
al%20-%20technical%20findings-with%20higher%20res%20pics.pdf

I've only briefly skimmed through that document, but it could be a bit
of a worry, as there would always be the potential fro things to go
wrong, and allow interference to peoples TV reception.

A lot of work has been done to characterise the interference
potential, and Ofcom have drawn up provisional plans for management of
a suitable database.
The problem with white-space devices is that they are third in line
for access to spectrum after TV and PMSE, and are subject to
switch-off if/when a large public event happens that requires several
TV channels for radio mics etc. Granted, this will not happen very
often in the rural areas where it is being promoted.
The biggest concern of course is that as the TV spectrum shrinks
before the inevitable expansion of mobile broadband, the amount of
white space available will also reduce. I don't see that WS devices
will have permanent access to this part of the spectrum.
  #4  
Old April 4th 13, 08:40 AM posted to uk.tech.broadcast,alt.radio.digital,uk.tech.digital-tv
Jim Lesurf[_2_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 4,326
Default White Spaces!....

In article ,
wrote:
On Wed, 03 Apr 2013 16:36:55 +0100, Richard Evans
wrote:


On 03/04/2013 13:02, tony sayer wrote:

Looks like more of the UHF broadcast band might be compromised;!...

http://www.cambridgewireless.co.uk/d...20Spaces%20Tri
al%20-%20technical%20findings-with%20higher%20res%20pics.pdf

I've only briefly skimmed through that document, but it could be a bit
of a worry, as there would always be the potential fro things to go
wrong, and allow interference to peoples TV reception.

A lot of work has been done to characterise the interference potential,
and Ofcom have drawn up provisional plans for management of a suitable
database.


Erm... would this be the same people who are allowing 4G to jam so much
DTTV with the get-out-clause of magic filters? I can't say I am confident
about this cunning plan...

Slainte,

Jim

--
Electronics http://www.st-and.ac.uk/~www_pa/Scot...o/electron.htm
Audio Misc http://www.audiomisc.co.uk/index.html
Armstrong Audio http://www.audiomisc.co.uk/Armstrong/armstrong.html
  #5  
Old April 4th 13, 10:37 AM posted to uk.tech.broadcast,alt.radio.digital,uk.tech.digital-tv
[email protected]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 1,245
Default White Spaces!....

On Thu, 04 Apr 2013 09:40:04 +0100, Jim Lesurf
wrote:

In article ,
wrote:
On Wed, 03 Apr 2013 16:36:55 +0100, Richard Evans
wrote:


On 03/04/2013 13:02, tony sayer wrote:

Looks like more of the UHF broadcast band might be compromised;!...

http://www.cambridgewireless.co.uk/d...20Spaces%20Tri
al%20-%20technical%20findings-with%20higher%20res%20pics.pdf

I've only briefly skimmed through that document, but it could be a bit
of a worry, as there would always be the potential fro things to go
wrong, and allow interference to peoples TV reception.

A lot of work has been done to characterise the interference potential,
and Ofcom have drawn up provisional plans for management of a suitable
database.


Erm... would this be the same people who are allowing 4G to jam so much
DTTV with the get-out-clause of magic filters? I can't say I am confident
about this cunning plan...

"You may say that my dear ..."
  #6  
Old April 5th 13, 01:36 AM posted to uk.tech.broadcast,alt.radio.digital,uk.tech.digital-tv
Stephen
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 115
Default White Spaces!....


wrote in message
...
On Wed, 03 Apr 2013 16:36:55 +0100, Richard Evans
wrote:

On 03/04/2013 13:02, tony sayer wrote:

Looks like more of the UHF broadcast band might be compromised;!...

http://www.cambridgewireless.co.uk/d...20Spaces%20Tri
al%20-%20technical%20findings-with%20higher%20res%20pics.pdf

I've only briefly skimmed through that document, but it could be a bit
of a worry, as there would always be the potential fro things to go
wrong, and allow interference to peoples TV reception.

A lot of work has been done to characterise the interference
potential, and Ofcom have drawn up provisional plans for management of
a suitable database.
The problem with white-space devices is that they are third in line
for access to spectrum after TV and PMSE, and are subject to
switch-off if/when a large public event happens that requires several
TV channels for radio mics etc. Granted, this will not happen very
often in the rural areas where it is being promoted.
The biggest concern of course is that as the TV spectrum shrinks
before the inevitable expansion of mobile broadband, the amount of
white space available will also reduce. I don't see that WS devices
will have permanent access to this part of the spectrum.


What actually happens between 230 MHz and 470 MHz (the top of Band III to
the bottom of Band IV)? How much use is actually made of the frequencies
between 300 MHz and 399 MHz for example? If they want to use the present UHF
TV channels for mobile broadband, then why can't we have 30 new TV channels
here?


  #7  
Old April 5th 13, 09:33 AM posted to uk.tech.broadcast,alt.radio.digital,uk.tech.digital-tv
[email protected]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 1,245
Default White Spaces!....

On Fri, 5 Apr 2013 02:36:35 +0100, "Stephen"
wrote:


wrote in message
.. .
On Wed, 03 Apr 2013 16:36:55 +0100, Richard Evans
wrote:

On 03/04/2013 13:02, tony sayer wrote:

Looks like more of the UHF broadcast band might be compromised;!...

http://www.cambridgewireless.co.uk/d...20Spaces%20Tri
al%20-%20technical%20findings-with%20higher%20res%20pics.pdf

I've only briefly skimmed through that document, but it could be a bit
of a worry, as there would always be the potential fro things to go
wrong, and allow interference to peoples TV reception.

A lot of work has been done to characterise the interference
potential, and Ofcom have drawn up provisional plans for management of
a suitable database.
The problem with white-space devices is that they are third in line
for access to spectrum after TV and PMSE, and are subject to
switch-off if/when a large public event happens that requires several
TV channels for radio mics etc. Granted, this will not happen very
often in the rural areas where it is being promoted.
The biggest concern of course is that as the TV spectrum shrinks
before the inevitable expansion of mobile broadband, the amount of
white space available will also reduce. I don't see that WS devices
will have permanent access to this part of the spectrum.


What actually happens between 230 MHz and 470 MHz (the top of Band III to
the bottom of Band IV)? How much use is actually made of the frequencies
between 300 MHz and 399 MHz for example? If they want to use the present UHF
TV channels for mobile broadband, then why can't we have 30 new TV channels
here?


http://stakeholders.ofcom.org.uk/bin...UKFAT_2013.pdf
  #8  
Old April 5th 13, 12:15 PM posted to uk.tech.broadcast,alt.radio.digital,uk.tech.digital-tv
Stephen
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 115
Default White Spaces!....

wrote in message
...
On Fri, 5 Apr 2013 02:36:35 +0100, "Stephen"
wrote:


wrote in message
. ..
On Wed, 03 Apr 2013 16:36:55 +0100, Richard Evans
wrote:

On 03/04/2013 13:02, tony sayer wrote:

Looks like more of the UHF broadcast band might be compromised;!...

http://www.cambridgewireless.co.uk/d...20Spaces%20Tri
al%20-%20technical%20findings-with%20higher%20res%20pics.pdf

I've only briefly skimmed through that document, but it could be a bit
of a worry, as there would always be the potential fro things to go
wrong, and allow interference to peoples TV reception.

A lot of work has been done to characterise the interference
potential, and Ofcom have drawn up provisional plans for management of
a suitable database.
The problem with white-space devices is that they are third in line
for access to spectrum after TV and PMSE, and are subject to
switch-off if/when a large public event happens that requires several
TV channels for radio mics etc. Granted, this will not happen very
often in the rural areas where it is being promoted.
The biggest concern of course is that as the TV spectrum shrinks
before the inevitable expansion of mobile broadband, the amount of
white space available will also reduce. I don't see that WS devices
will have permanent access to this part of the spectrum.


What actually happens between 230 MHz and 470 MHz (the top of Band III to
the bottom of Band IV)? How much use is actually made of the frequencies
between 300 MHz and 399 MHz for example? If they want to use the present
UHF
TV channels for mobile broadband, then why can't we have 30 new TV
channels
here?


http://stakeholders.ofcom.org.uk/bin...UKFAT_2013.pdf


Thanks for that. Most of the space between Band III (230 MHz) and Band IV
(470 MHz) is described as FIXED MOBILE. What does that mean?

There are small sections with a meaningful description, but the vast
majority of this spectrum is just labelled FIXED MOBILE. Who uses it for
what, when & how often? Is it a historical military allocation that is
rarely used? Perhaps it is time to reconsider this allocation, because it
amounts to half of the entire frequency spectrum below Band IV, and with the
increasing pressure from mobile phone & broadband for the frequencies above,
it would be a very useful resource, and have great commercial value.


  #9  
Old April 5th 13, 12:46 PM posted to uk.tech.broadcast,alt.radio.digital,uk.tech.digital-tv
[email protected]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 41
Default White Spaces!....

On Fri, 5 Apr 2013 13:15:10 +0100
"Stephen" wrote:
Thanks for that. Most of the space between Band III (230 MHz) and Band IV
(470 MHz) is described as FIXED MOBILE. What does that mean?


The fixed base station side of mobile comms?

amounts to half of the entire frequency spectrum below Band IV, and with the
increasing pressure from mobile phone & broadband for the frequencies above,
it would be a very useful resource, and have great commercial value.


TBH a couple of hundred megahertz here or there is nothing these days when
digital comms is heading to point where hundreds of Mhz if not GHZ data
bandwidths are being considered.

--
Spud

 




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