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uk.tech.digital-tv (Digital TV - General) (uk.tech.digital-tv) Discussion of all matters technical in origin related to the reception of digital television transmissions, be they via satellite, terrestrial or cable. Advertising is forbidden, with no exceptions.

Digital Switchover + Ariel



 
 
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  #21  
Old March 11th 12, 05:47 PM posted to uk.tech.digital-tv
Bill Wright[_2_]
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Posts: 9,381
Default Digital Switchover + Ariel

Scott wrote:

I wonder how many people are tuned into a distant transmitter and
thinking the reception is worse now than it was before the
switch-over?


Constant cause of call-outs. We are fitting every sort of filter to our
communal systems as fast as possible.

Bill
Ads
  #22  
Old March 11th 12, 05:56 PM posted to uk.tech.digital-tv
Bill Wright[_2_]
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Posts: 9,381
Default Digital Switchover + Ariel

Adrian wrote:
Scott wrote:
On Sun, 11 Mar 2012 05:43:48 -0700 (PDT), species8350
wrote:

I posted the messge below into the wrong group. I am reposing here to
see if there are other views.

I use analogue TV, but will soon lose the channels.

The reception for digital is not good with my existing arial


Is there a quick way for me to increase the gain of my current arial

Don't use washing powder
http://www.ariel.co.uk/Products/ArielPowder.aspx

Use an aerial instead :-)


I knew someone would get on their soapbox about the spelling.

They just want to DAZzle us with their erudition. Funnily enough I was
in the laundrette the other day and the place was full of Omos.

Bill
  #23  
Old March 11th 12, 06:18 PM posted to uk.tech.digital-tv
Stephen Wolstenholme[_2_]
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Posts: 265
Default Digital Switchover + Ariel

On Sun, 11 Mar 2012 17:31:23 +0000, Bill Wright
wrote:

Stephen Wolstenholme wrote:

Is there a quick way for me to increase the gain of my current arial


Fit an amplifier. Redirect your aerial.

Steve

As an aerial installer with 45 years experience I still haven't learnt
how to diagnose a
need for realignment and amplification, and discount all other
possibilities, without actually seeing the installation. I must be so thick.

Bill


As an ex aerial installer I know what you mean but the OP wanted a
quick way DIY method so that's what I am suggesting.

Steve

--
Neural Network Software. http://www.npsl1.com
EasyNN-plus. Neural Networks plus. http://www.easynn.com
SwingNN. Forecast with Neural Networks. http://www.swingnn.com
JustNN. Just Neural Networks. http://www.justnn.com

  #24  
Old March 11th 12, 06:37 PM posted to uk.tech.digital-tv
Andy Burns[_7_]
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Posts: 1,278
Default Digital Switchover + Ariel

Stephen Wolstenholme wrote:

As an ex aerial installer I know what you mean but the OP wanted a
quick way DIY method so that's what I am suggesting.


The O/P clearly knows that DSO means analogue will be going away, but
it's not so clear that s/he knows digital reception is likely to improve
for at least two of the SD muxes without doing anything.

  #25  
Old March 11th 12, 06:37 PM posted to uk.tech.digital-tv
Scott[_2_]
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Posts: 1,344
Default Digital Switchover + Ariel

On Sun, 11 Mar 2012 17:10:42 +0000, Mark Carver
wrote:

J G Miller wrote:

I think you are misunderstanding what Charles wrote.

Apart from the major power / major population analog relays which
also broadcast the digital multiplexes prior to analog switch off
(and which were not in fact digital relays but daughter stations),
no other relay site transmitted any digital services at all, with
the special exception of Ferryside.


I think you've misunderstood what Scott misunderstood about what Charles wrote.

I think Scott thought Charles was inferring that a relay wouldn't carry the
same regional variation as the main station. Of course it does.

What Charles was getting at (I think) is that relays will be serving areas
that their parent main station does not cover. Because the majority of relays
before DSO did not/do not carry any digital services, then many people will
have no digital reception at all, until that relay undergoes DSO.


At the risk of misunderstanding your understanding of my
misunderstanding, Charles referred to 'any digital you are getting
now' so he seems to be contemplating people in relay areas that do
receive digital signals of some sort and I am suggesting these are
most likely to come from the corresponding main transmitter though of
course they may come from an adjacent main transmitter that may carry
a different regional variation.
  #26  
Old March 11th 12, 06:43 PM posted to uk.tech.digital-tv
Woody[_4_]
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Posts: 1,014
Default Digital Switchover + Ariel

"Java Jive" wrote in message
...
On Sun, 11 Mar 2012 05:43:48 -0700 (PDT), species8350
wrote:

I use analogue TV, but will soon lose the channels.

The reception for digital is not good with my existing arial


Pre Digital-Switch-Over digital broadcast come/came only from a
subset
of 80 out of 1130-40 transmitters, and at greatly reduced power
compared with pre-existing analogue broadcasts. From any given
transmitter after DSO, allowing for improvements in receiver
sensitivity, digital broadcasts will be comparable in strength
to
former analogue broadcasts.

Is there a quick way for me to increase the gain of my current
arial


Very probably you don't need to do this. I would wait at least
until
after DSO Stage 1, probably Stage 2, to see how things pan out.

Although there have been many variations at given transmitters,
generally:

1) At DSO Stage 1, BBC 2 analogue (and where applicable at the
80
aforementioned transmitters, the weaker pre-DSO digital
multiplex/mux
known variously as PSB 1/Mux A/BBC A) is(are) switched off, and
replaced by the BBC A mux at full power.

2) At Stage 2, all remaining analogue (and where applicable
weaker
pre-DSO digital) broadcasts are switched off and are replaced
with at
least the remaining two PSB muxes, D3&4 and BBC B(HD), and, if
one of
the aforementioned 80 transmitters, the three Com muxes, all at
full
power.

So, if after Stage 1 you can pick up the BBC A mux, thus
getting
digital versions of all the BBC channels, you shouldn't need to
worry.

If you want a canter around the DSO course beforehand, you will
probably find this section on my site useful:
http://www.macfh.co.uk/JavaJive/Audi...estrialTV.html
--



JJ has explained it very clearly except for one thing.

If you are getting some digital now no matter how bad you will
have to do a factory reset on your TV and then a retune at DSO1.
Unless your TV is one of the latest clever machines, if you
retune without doing a reset the TV will continue to look for
BBC stations where it thinks they are now and will ignore the new
signals. Reset and then retune and it will find the new mux
properly.

You will have to do the same again after DSO2 for the same
reasons.

Note also that if your existing analogue signal comes from a low
power relay - as the information provided suggests - you will
only get a limited number of TV stations post DSO2 (from memory
about 14.) You will loose quite a few that you may have now if
you are receiving scratchy signals from a main station.

As others have said, tell us where you are located, which
direction (roughly) your aerial points and its polarity, i.e. are
the prongs or X's vertical or horizontal. Then someone will come
flying along and give you pretty much exact details of what you
were and will be getting.


--
Woody

harrogate three at ntlworld dot com


  #27  
Old March 11th 12, 07:19 PM posted to uk.tech.digital-tv
Alan[_4_]
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Posts: 429
Default Digital Switchover + Ariel

In message , Scott
wrote


http://www.ariel.co.uk/Products/ArielPowder.aspx


or
http://www.satcure.com/tech/digital_ariel.htm
--
Alan
news2009 {at} admac {dot} myzen {dot} co {dot} uk
  #28  
Old March 11th 12, 07:50 PM posted to uk.tech.digital-tv
Scott[_2_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 1,344
Default Digital Switchover + Ariel

On Sun, 11 Mar 2012 19:19:11 +0000, Alan
wrote:

In message , Scott
wrote


http://www.ariel.co.uk/Products/ArielPowder.aspx


or
http://www.satcure.com/tech/digital_ariel.htm


I like it :-)

I visited the nation's best known electrical group last weekend and I
see they are offering 'HD ready aerials'. I felt like asking if they
had any full HD aerials in stock!
  #29  
Old March 11th 12, 07:53 PM posted to uk.tech.digital-tv
charles
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Posts: 4,016
Default Digital Switchover + Ariel

In article , Scott
wrote:
On Sun, 11 Mar 2012 17:10:42 +0000, Mark Carver
wrote:


J G Miller wrote:

I think you are misunderstanding what Charles wrote.

Apart from the major power / major population analog relays which also
broadcast the digital multiplexes prior to analog switch off (and
which were not in fact digital relays but daughter stations), no other
relay site transmitted any digital services at all, with the special
exception of Ferryside.


I think you've misunderstood what Scott misunderstood about what Charles
wrote.

I think Scott thought Charles was inferring that a relay wouldn't carry
the same regional variation as the main station. Of course it does.

What Charles was getting at (I think) is that relays will be serving
areas that their parent main station does not cover. Because the
majority of relays before DSO did not/do not carry any digital
services, then many people will have no digital reception at all, until
that relay undergoes DSO.


At the risk of misunderstanding your understanding of my
misunderstanding, Charles referred to 'any digital you are getting now'
so he seems to be contemplating people in relay areas that do receive
digital signals of some sort and I am suggesting these are most likely to
come from the corresponding main transmitter though of course they may
come from an adjacent main transmitter that may carry a different
regional variation.


I certainly wasn't thinking about different regions. In many cases, relay
stations are needed to cope with ghosting on the main transmitter. As a
consequence, people in the relay's service area may receive signals from
the main station which are unuseable for analogue. They therefore could
receive digital signals from the main station, but with the aerial pointing
in the wrong direction, wrong polarization and wrong group, these digital
signals will be poor. Wait until your local relay starts transmitting
digiatal signals before doing anything.

--
From KT24

Using a RISC OS computer running v5.18

  #30  
Old March 11th 12, 08:24 PM posted to uk.tech.digital-tv
Scott[_2_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 1,344
Default Digital Switchover + Ariel

On Sun, 11 Mar 2012 19:53:01 +0000 (GMT), charles
wrote:

In article , Scott
wrote:
On Sun, 11 Mar 2012 17:10:42 +0000, Mark Carver
wrote:


J G Miller wrote:

I think you are misunderstanding what Charles wrote.

Apart from the major power / major population analog relays which also
broadcast the digital multiplexes prior to analog switch off (and
which were not in fact digital relays but daughter stations), no other
relay site transmitted any digital services at all, with the special
exception of Ferryside.

I think you've misunderstood what Scott misunderstood about what Charles
wrote.

I think Scott thought Charles was inferring that a relay wouldn't carry
the same regional variation as the main station. Of course it does.

What Charles was getting at (I think) is that relays will be serving
areas that their parent main station does not cover. Because the
majority of relays before DSO did not/do not carry any digital
services, then many people will have no digital reception at all, until
that relay undergoes DSO.


At the risk of misunderstanding your understanding of my
misunderstanding, Charles referred to 'any digital you are getting now'
so he seems to be contemplating people in relay areas that do receive
digital signals of some sort and I am suggesting these are most likely to
come from the corresponding main transmitter though of course they may
come from an adjacent main transmitter that may carry a different
regional variation.


I certainly wasn't thinking about different regions. In many cases, relay
stations are needed to cope with ghosting on the main transmitter. As a
consequence, people in the relay's service area may receive signals from
the main station which are unuseable for analogue. They therefore could
receive digital signals from the main station, but with the aerial pointing
in the wrong direction, wrong polarization and wrong group, these digital
signals will be poor. Wait until your local relay starts transmitting
digiatal signals before doing anything.


I certainly agree with the advice to wait.

However, AIUI digital is less prone to multipath interference
(ghosing) than analogue so the best option might then be to use the
main transmitter (with the correct aerial pointing in the right
direction). This would provide a bigger selection of channels (albeit
many of them shopping channels).

I have arranged to take down a second aerial pointing at a local relay
and to replace my main aerial with a Group B aerial pointing at the
main transmitter, to feed both TVs. (This is also to try to minimise
the risk of 4G interference as the relay uses channel 59).

 




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