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OT - Dragons' Den Standby Saver



 
 
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  #91  
Old August 13th 07, 02:36 PM posted to uk.tech.digital-tv
John Rumm
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Posts: 982
Default OT - Dragons' Den Standby Saver

Pyriform wrote:

Then there's the cost of distributing your coal/gas/oil, thermodynamic
losses in gas pipes, and the carbon footprint of transporting coal and
oil far exceed high voltage lines per erg of energy used.


Ergs? Does anyone actually use that unit these days? I'm an SI man, myself.
Anyway, without actual numbers we are both handwaving to some extent. I
would be very surprised if the carbon cost of burning gas domestically for
heating was higher than the cost of burning it in a power station in order
to convert a percentage of the heat produced into electricity, sending that
through the power grid and then turning what's left of it back into heat at
the consumer's premises. But I'd be interested to learn otherwise. Then
perhaps we should start advocating all-electric houses, rather than
extolling the virtues of inefficient standby modes!


I would also be very surprised if total electric efficiency could come
even close to gas for domestic heating. The basic laws of thermodynamics
limit the efficiency of the power station before you even include
transmission losses. Compared to a modern condensing gas boiler with
91% efficiency and very little in the way of transmission losses down

a pipeline.

You may be able to shift the equation a little with nuclear power
generation.

--
Cheers,

John.

/================================================== ===============\
| Internode Ltd - http://www.internode.co.uk |
|-----------------------------------------------------------------|
| John Rumm - john(at)internode(dot)co(dot)uk |
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  #92  
Old August 13th 07, 05:22 PM posted to uk.tech.digital-tv
Mike
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 33
Default OT - Dragons' Den Standby Saver

In article . com,
larkim wrote:
My washing machine actually draws a current when it is "off".


I've got an RCCB (plug in type) which was placed in line with a submersible
mains pump. The socket is not switched, so the TEST/RESET switches double
as an on-off switch for the pump.

The RCCB emits a small amount of heat when off. I've no idea why. It draws
no measurable current/power, according to a plug-in meter.
--
--------------------------------------+------------------------------------
Mike Brown: mjb[at]pootle.demon.co.uk | http://www.pootle.demon.co.uk/
  #93  
Old August 13th 07, 05:39 PM posted to uk.tech.digital-tv
Mike Harrison
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 71
Default OT - Dragons' Den Standby Saver

On Mon, 13 Aug 2007 15:36:59 +0100, John Rumm wrote:

Pyriform wrote:

Then there's the cost of distributing your coal/gas/oil, thermodynamic
losses in gas pipes, and the carbon footprint of transporting coal and
oil far exceed high voltage lines per erg of energy used.


Ergs? Does anyone actually use that unit these days? I'm an SI man, myself.
Anyway, without actual numbers we are both handwaving to some extent. I
would be very surprised if the carbon cost of burning gas domestically for
heating was higher than the cost of burning it in a power station in order
to convert a percentage of the heat produced into electricity, sending that
through the power grid and then turning what's left of it back into heat at
the consumer's premises. But I'd be interested to learn otherwise. Then
perhaps we should start advocating all-electric houses, rather than
extolling the virtues of inefficient standby modes!


I would also be very surprised if total electric efficiency could come
even close to gas for domestic heating. The basic laws of thermodynamics
limit the efficiency of the power station before you even include
transmission losses. Compared to a modern condensing gas boiler with
91% efficiency and very little in the way of transmission losses down

a pipeline.


I wonder how much energy is needed to pump the gas down the pipe ?
 




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