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UK Government's "Digital" Advisor



 
 
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  #1  
Old November 5th 03, 07:38 PM posted to alt.radio.digital,uk.tech.broadcast,uk.tech.digital-tv
DAB sounds worse than FM
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 209
Default UK Government's "Digital" Advisor

I watched Click Online on BBC News 24 a couple of days ago and there was a
short article about digital TV on, and on it they interviewed Barry Cox
who's the UK Government's digital TV advisor.

He said that apparently the US wants HDTV, whereas we're happy about the
picture quality we get.

We want extra channels and to use the extra frequencies that analogue will
release for "other purposes", although he doesn't know what these other
purposes are yet, but they'll probably be for "versions" of mobile
telephones apparently, or "new forms of television".

Germany are very interested in mobile TV. Who on earth told him that we
aren't interested in it?

And interestingly, consumers have to say that they want HDTV so that the
broadcasters will broadcast it and then the manufacturers will manufacture
the equipment!!!!!! Well, bugger me sideways, we just need to ask and we'll
get HDTV. Now why didn't we think of that before?

And now the best bit, when asked about the picture quality of digital TV, Mr
Cox said that it is possible for broadcasters to manipulate the signal in
such a way that some people sometimes think the picture quality is sometimes
lower, sometimes.

HOWEVER, Mr Cox in his infinite wisdom on such matters has this to say:

"I have to say, as someone who watches digital TV a lot, and terrestrial
digital TV, I don't see any difference at all in the picture, and in fact
when I go to widescreen I can get a much better picture than I can get on
analogue TV".


So, Mr Cox thinks that picture quality is dependent on the size of the
screen rather than the quality of the image. I'm not saying that incorrect
aspect ratio is good, just that he's talking nonsense.

So, if he's the Government's "digital" advisor heaven help us, cos whereas
the US are going to get HDTV and the Germans are going to get mobile TV,
we're going to get more channels, no HDTV, maybe no mobile TV, but a load of
spare spectrum for mobile phones to use so that the Government can make some
more dosh on a spectrum auction (all spectrum is auctioned these days IIRC),
and the broadcasters can avoid investing in HDTV, and the Government can
avoid having to free extra spectrum that HDTV would need, and they all sit
there with lots of dosh in their bank accounts and we just get more of the
same tripe delivered to us, and then only if we're not mobile.

I wonder why Sky would be against mobile TV?

UK broadcasting is an utter joke these days.


Here's the members of the Digital Television Stakeholders' Group that he
heads:

http://www.politicallinks.co.uk/poli...ervice/cox.asp


So, HDTV just after we're all dead then. Very kind of you Mr Cox, BBC, Sky
et al.....


To see the interview watch this (Barry Cox's interview starts after 1 minute
10 seconds):

High bit rate -

http://stream.servstream.com/ViewWeb...sx?Media=10964


Medium bit rate -

http://stream.servstream.com/ViewWeb...x?Media=109643

Low bit rate -

http://stream.servstream.com/ViewWeb...x?Media=109642

--
Steve - http://www.digitalradiotech.co.uk/ - Digital Radio News & Info

DAB sounds worse than Freeview, digital satellite, cable, broadband internet
and FM


Ads
  #2  
Old November 5th 03, 10:05 PM posted to alt.radio.digital,uk.tech.broadcast,uk.tech.digital-tv
Stuart
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 75
Default UK Government's "Digital" Advisor

DAB sounds worse than FM wrote:
I watched Click Online on BBC News 24 a couple of days ago and there was a
short article about digital TV on, and on it they interviewed Barry Cox
who's the UK Government's digital TV advisor.

He said that apparently the US wants HDTV, whereas we're happy about the
picture quality we get.



Can't stand Barry Cox, but he is probably right... the majority of the
British public don't know what HDTV is, and having X number of more
channels sounds more sexy.

S.

  #3  
Old November 5th 03, 10:37 PM posted to alt.radio.digital,uk.tech.broadcast,uk.tech.digital-tv
Ivor Jones
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 20
Default UK Government's "Digital" Advisor


"Stuart" wrote in message
...
DAB sounds worse than FM wrote:
I watched Click Online on BBC News 24 a couple of days ago and there was

a
short article about digital TV on, and on it they interviewed Barry Cox
who's the UK Government's digital TV advisor.

He said that apparently the US wants HDTV, whereas we're happy about the
picture quality we get.



Can't stand Barry Cox, but he is probably right... the majority of the
British public don't know what HDTV is, and having X number of more
channels sounds more sexy.


Hmmph..! I've seen HDTV in the US and it knocks spots off anything I've ever
seen before. I'd rather have the 5 terrestrial channels in HDTV than any
numbe of satellite offerings in mediocre quality.

Here's a link to a page on a friend's site who is an engineer with a US TV
station, it gives some interesting tech info on the systems in use:

www.choisser.com/broadcst.html

Ivor


  #4  
Old November 6th 03, 12:02 AM posted to alt.radio.digital,uk.tech.broadcast,uk.tech.digital-tv
Java Jive
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 1,294
Default UK Government's "Digital" Advisor

I take it that 'digital' in this context means ...

/'_/)
,/_ /
/ /
/'_'/' '/'_'7,
/'/ / / /"
('( ' ' _~/
\ '
'\' \ _7
\ (
\ \.

.... to HDTV.

( acknowledgements for the ascii art to an American posting under the alias
'Dave' )

"DAB sounds worse than FM" wrote in message
...

Barry Cox who's the UK Government's digital TV advisor.



  #5  
Old November 6th 03, 05:33 AM posted to alt.radio.digital,uk.tech.broadcast,uk.tech.digital-tv
Rayzor_uk
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 2
Default UK Government's "Digital" Advisor


"DAB sounds worse than FM" wrote in message
...
I watched Click Online on BBC News 24 a couple of days ago and there was a
short article about digital TV on, and on it they interviewed Barry Cox
who's the UK Government's digital TV advisor.

He said that apparently the US wants HDTV, whereas we're happy about the
picture quality we get.

We want extra channels and to use the extra frequencies that analogue will
release for "other purposes", although he doesn't know what these other
purposes are yet, but they'll probably be for "versions" of mobile
telephones apparently, or "new forms of television".

Germany are very interested in mobile TV. Who on earth told him that we
aren't interested in it?

And interestingly, consumers have to say that they want HDTV so that the
broadcasters will broadcast it and then the manufacturers will manufacture
the equipment!!!!!! Well, bugger me sideways, we just need to ask and

we'll
get HDTV. Now why didn't we think of that before?

And now the best bit, when asked about the picture quality of digital TV,

Mr
Cox said that it is possible for broadcasters to manipulate the signal in
such a way that some people sometimes think the picture quality is

sometimes
lower, sometimes.

HOWEVER, Mr Cox in his infinite wisdom on such matters has this to say:

"I have to say, as someone who watches digital TV a lot, and terrestrial
digital TV, I don't see any difference at all in the picture, and in fact
when I go to widescreen I can get a much better picture than I can get on
analogue TV".


So, Mr Cox thinks that picture quality is dependent on the size of the
screen rather than the quality of the image. I'm not saying that incorrect
aspect ratio is good, just that he's talking nonsense.

So, if he's the Government's "digital" advisor heaven help us, cos whereas
the US are going to get HDTV and the Germans are going to get mobile TV,
we're going to get more channels, no HDTV, maybe no mobile TV, but a load

of
spare spectrum for mobile phones to use so that the Government can make

some
more dosh on a spectrum auction (all spectrum is auctioned these days

IIRC),
and the broadcasters can avoid investing in HDTV, and the Government can
avoid having to free extra spectrum that HDTV would need, and they all sit
there with lots of dosh in their bank accounts and we just get more of the
same tripe delivered to us, and then only if we're not mobile.

I wonder why Sky would be against mobile TV?

UK broadcasting is an utter joke these days.


Here's the members of the Digital Television Stakeholders' Group that he
heads:


http://www.politicallinks.co.uk/poli...vil%20Service/
cox.asp


So, HDTV just after we're all dead then. Very kind of you Mr Cox, BBC, Sky
et al.....


To see the interview watch this (Barry Cox's interview starts after 1

minute
10 seconds):

High bit rate -


http://stream.servstream.com/ViewWeb...301003_intervi
ew_hi.asx?Media=10964


Medium bit rate -


http://stream.servstream.com/ViewWeb...301003_intervi
ew_hi.asx?Media=109643

Low bit rate -


http://stream.servstream.com/ViewWeb...301003_intervi
ew_hi.asx?Media=109642

--
Steve - http://www.digitalradiotech.co.uk/ - Digital Radio News & Info

DAB sounds worse than Freeview, digital satellite, cable, broadband

internet
and FM

Your the joke round here




  #6  
Old November 6th 03, 05:48 AM posted to alt.radio.digital,uk.tech.broadcast,uk.tech.digital-tv
Malcolm Knight
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 21
Default UK Government's "Digital" Advisor


"Rayzor_uk" wrote in message
...

Your the joke round here


With your lack of expertise in grammar, spelling, ability to snip or
have a single original thought in your head, I think you will find
that is you.


  #7  
Old November 6th 03, 07:26 AM posted to alt.radio.digital,uk.tech.broadcast,uk.tech.digital-tv
DAB sounds worse than FM
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 209
Default UK Government's "Digital" Advisor

Rayzor_uk wrote:

Your the joke round here



That should be "You are the joke around here."

Could I congratulate you on being the dumbest **** that has ever appeared on
this newsgroup, which given alistairk24 only very recently being on here
really is a bit of a good effort, well done.

Your use of puncuation won the day for you. Other posts made by you
confirmed that your understanding and use of puncuation is truly abysmal,
and on a par with people with a mental age of 5. (my 6 year old niece has
got better grammar than you)

This was possibly your finest post:

http://tinyurl.com/tv6o

where you wrote this very fine "sentence":

"you need bittorrent first so download that search on google it aint hard
the
also using google search for bittorrent links
heres one"

And you're even a master of irony:

http://tinyurl.com/tv6w

where you wrote this classic put down:

"you should stay at university a while longer and improve your spelling

ie sole we think u mean stole"


but failed to include any puncuation in the first sentence, and the order in
which you chose your words for the second "sentence" was nothing short of
inspiring.

And then there was this other classic:

http://tinyurl.com/tv74

where you got a bit carried away with the old punctuation, but you had a
rush of blood after having already included a capital letter in the sentence
and unfortunately when you lunged for the apostrophe key your hand went into
spasm, you missed the apostrphe key and hit the full-stop key instead:

"Ur right he.s a right ****** old bertram"

But it was undoubtedly a very good try.

Also, do you have Turretes (sp?) Syndrome? Looking for your posts on Google
Groups found about half of your posts were just replies to posts but you
hadn't written anything. So I'm just wondering whether you have Turretes
Syndrome where you have a tick which affects your whole body and you end up
hitting the send button while shouting out "********" very loudly? That
would also explain your use of a fullstop instead of an apostrophe.

With all my love and best wishes,

--
Steve - http://www.digitalradiotech.co.uk/ - Digital Radio News & Info

DAB sounds worse than Freeview, digital satellite, cable, broadband
internet and FM


  #8  
Old November 6th 03, 08:57 AM posted to alt.radio.digital,uk.tech.broadcast,uk.tech.digital-tv
Silk
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 565
Default UK Government's "Digital" Advisor

DAB sounds worse than FM wrote:

(my 6 year old niece has
got better grammar than you)


Why the unnecessary use of the word "got"?

Glass houses, he who is without sin, etcetera, etcetera, etcetera.

  #9  
Old November 6th 03, 08:58 AM posted to alt.radio.digital,uk.tech.broadcast,uk.tech.digital-tv
David Robinson
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 252
Default UK Government's "Digital" Advisor

"Ivor Jones" wrote in message ...
"Stuart" wrote in message
...
DAB sounds worse than FM wrote:
I watched Click Online on BBC News 24 a couple of days ago and there was

a
short article about digital TV on, and on it they interviewed Barry Cox
who's the UK Government's digital TV advisor.

He said that apparently the US wants HDTV, whereas we're happy about the
picture quality we get.



Can't stand Barry Cox, but he is probably right... the majority of the
British public don't know what HDTV is, and having X number of more
channels sounds more sexy.


Hmmph..! I've seen HDTV in the US and it knocks spots off anything I've ever
seen before. I'd rather have the 5 terrestrial channels in HDTV than any
numbe of satellite offerings in mediocre quality.


Ditto. And the thing is, it's not a subtle difference - it's night and
day. If the government want an economic argument, here's one: people
won't buy hi-end (read: expensive, e.g. plasma) TVs to watch standard
definition pictures delivered at 2-4Mbps MPEG-2. See
http://www.ebu.ch/tech_texts/tech_text_i34-2002.pdf

The strange thing is, we are getting fewer active lines, not more.
Think about the black lines on 16:9 films on analogue, or 2.53(?):1
films on DVD.

Comparing SDTV and HDTV side by side in a shop makes the more
expensive TV seem worth having (if you can afford it - and prices are
falling). In fact, it make SDTV seems like the 50 year old technology
that it is.

Cheers,
David.
  #10  
Old November 6th 03, 11:53 AM posted to alt.radio.digital,uk.tech.broadcast,uk.tech.digital-tv
Ted Richardson
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 21
Default UK Government's "Digital" Advisor

"Ivor Jones" wrote in message ...

Hmmph..! I've seen HDTV in the US and it knocks spots off anything I've ever
seen before. I'd rather have the 5 terrestrial channels in HDTV than any
numbe of satellite offerings in mediocre quality.


Agreed, it does. Forgive a few comments here, hopefully not a rant!

Strikes me that digital SDTV could well be a lot better, the
deficiencies that we see are largely a matter of choice in the
reaching of compromises by the broadcasters. Were a higher
bandwidth to be afforded to (say) the main BBC channels, then the DTV
version of a programme would be at least as good as a clear feed of
the analogue version. At the moment, it is not, we all know that the
compromises within the DTT (and D-SAT) transmission chains mean that
for instance, during a football match there are passages where on a
good analogue display with a clean signal you can see the blades of
grass, on the MPEG equivalent there's just a green(ish) blur.

The decisions on the constitution of DTV seem to have been driven by
historical perceived inadequacy in each territory. Hence in the US,
where there were a plentiful supply of channels, but often appalling
reception, this couples with he American's love of large TVs to
produce a requirement for HDTV. In the UK there's a perceived lack
of channels, and an acceptance that whilst we have the best broadcast
engineering standards in the World, the viewers will put up with
pretty lousy sub-VHS standard pictures most of the time – hence for
DTV – cram then in.

There seems to be a push from the broadcasters, particularly the BBC,
to make DTT match (D-SAT) in every aspect of its functionality, which
of course it can't. For DTT (and probably cable) the best, and
optimum, that could be achieved here would be decent standard
definition digital television (SDTV). That means expanding the
bandwidth available to individual services, and reducing the number of
channels, probably not by much. There still appears to be the
capacity for this to happen in each of the four demises within
Freeview (BBC, Digital¾, SDN, and CCI).

HDTV would be great here; if there were a large population of large
image displays, like gas plasma units amongst the viewers. At circa
£k4 these are unlikely to become family Christmas presents until at
least the year after next. HDTV in the UK, and probably Western
Europe could take the form of a separate D-SAT transmission (or a
helper) augmenting the SDTV broadcasts of the main terrestrial
channels and a few of the Premium and PPV channels. Perhaps these
broadcasts may even be intermittent, depending on the availability of
HDTV content, with reversion to the SDTV version of the programme at
other times. Presumably all HDTV will be D-SAT delivered using
streams of 16 to 18 Mb/s.

Without some sort of driver, I can't see HDTV begin to reach a market;
however, there are a large number of plasma displays usually in the
high street windows of the more upmarket retailers (independents
mainly). Typically these will be playing a DVD. Is there a case
for a D-SAT delivered HDTV test transmission, essentially as a
marketing tool for the trade?
 




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