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[OT] Dual-Gang switched 13A + USB sockets



 
 
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  #11  
Old October 7th 17, 08:39 AM posted to uk.tech.digital-tv
Brian Gaff
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 6,958
Default [OT] Dual-Gang switched 13A + USB sockets

Exactly, and they seem to chuck out more when open circuit than when under
load and no they are always on in my experience.
Heap of trouble in the future I'm sure.
Brian

--
----- -
This newsgroup posting comes to you directly from...
The Sofa of Brian Gaff...

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"Jeff Layman" wrote in message
news
On 05/10/17 21:17, Pinnerite wrote:
I need to partially rewire my apartment. I am tempted to replace some old
double-switched sockets with those that incorporate USB sockets.

Some are described as Switched USB Socket 13A 2-gang + 2 USB.

Can I assume that the USB sockets on these are actually switched and
carry
no current until a plug is inserted?

If you have any experience of these things I would appreciate the benefit
of
your know-how.


Somewhat OT to your question, but what is the RFI like from these
unswitchable USB power supplies? There's an interesting video here showing
the interference from a cheap and nasty power supply compared to a branded
one. OK, it's not USB but the principle is the same. What I found
interesting was that there was a fair amount of RFI even when the rubbish
SMPS was unloaded. That's somewhat similar to the situation with these
built-in mains-socket USB power supplies. I just hope they're well
filtered. At least you can unplug a noisy wallwart!

--

Jeff



  #12  
Old October 7th 17, 09:27 AM posted to uk.tech.digital-tv
Roderick Stewart[_3_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 2,180
Default [OT] Dual-Gang switched 13A + USB sockets

On Fri, 06 Oct 2017 22:07:08 +0100, pamela wrote:

Yes and I hate this idea, looks to me like an accident waiting
to happen. Tiny switch mode psus kicking out crud all the time
and one large mains spike and goodness knows what is going to be
coming out of that usb.

Brian


In addition to that, if you have a dozen of these mains powered
USB sockets then the power consumption may not be trivial for a
year.


Also, the USB charging sockets in 13A wall panels are likely to be
generic 5V sources, so if your phone/tablet/etc can use one of the
fast charging methods (e.g. Qualcom Quickcharge 3) where the charger
increases the voltage, you won't have the advantage of this.

My Samsung phone, for example, charges at about 14W in fast charge
mode, but around 5 to 7W from a bog standard charger, and of course
only around 2W when plugged into a computer, so it's an advantage well
worth having. IMHO, it's best to use proper chargers designed for the
job and plug them into the mains as necessary.

Rod.

---
This email has been checked for viruses by AVG.
http://www.avg.com

  #13  
Old October 7th 17, 08:24 PM posted to uk.tech.digital-tv
Graham.[_12_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 422
Default [OT] Dual-Gang switched 13A + USB sockets

On Thu, 05 Oct 2017 21:17:30 +0100, Pinnerite
coalesced the vapors of human experience into a viable and meaningful
comprehension...

I need to partially rewire my apartment. I am tempted to replace some old
double-switched sockets with those that incorporate USB sockets.

Some are described as Switched USB Socket 13A 2-gang + 2 USB.

Can I assume that the USB sockets on these are actually switched and carry
no current until a plug is inserted?

If you have any experience of these things I would appreciate the benefit of
your know-how.


The MK sockets and the cabling in this house are over 40 years old,
just as compliant to modern regs, and showing no sign of
deterioration.

What are the chances of 5vDC from a Type 1 USB receptacle still being
a standard in 2057?

--

Graham.
%Profound_observation%
  #14  
Old October 7th 17, 10:59 PM posted to uk.tech.digital-tv
Bill Wright[_3_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 2,095
Default [OT] Dual-Gang switched 13A + USB sockets

On 07/10/2017 20:24, Graham. wrote:
On Thu, 05 Oct 2017 21:17:30 +0100, Pinnerite
coalesced the vapors of human experience into a viable and meaningful
comprehension...

I need to partially rewire my apartment. I am tempted to replace some old
double-switched sockets with those that incorporate USB sockets.

Some are described as Switched USB Socket 13A 2-gang + 2 USB.

Can I assume that the USB sockets on these are actually switched and carry
no current until a plug is inserted?

If you have any experience of these things I would appreciate the benefit of
your know-how.


The MK sockets and the cabling in this house are over 40 years old,
just as compliant to modern regs, and showing no sign of
deterioration.

What are the chances of 5vDC from a Type 1 USB receptacle still being
a standard in 2057?

Posh houses built or rewired in the early 1960s sometimes had a daisy
chain made from the thin coax they used in those days, linking aerial
sockets in every relevant room. The sockets were usually surface mount
Belling and Lee. I encountered this in a bishop's palace in 1985 or
thereabouts. The aerial was in the loft. Field strength was very good
and the only symptom was poor teletext.

Bill
  #15  
Old October 8th 17, 12:18 PM posted to uk.tech.digital-tv
R. Mark Clayton[_2_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 548
Default [OT] Dual-Gang switched 13A + USB sockets

On Saturday, 7 October 2017 20:24:18 UTC+1, Graham. wrote:
On Thu, 05 Oct 2017 21:17:30 +0100, Pinnerite
coalesced the vapors of human experience into a viable and meaningful
comprehension...

I need to partially rewire my apartment. I am tempted to replace some old
double-switched sockets with those that incorporate USB sockets.

Some are described as Switched USB Socket 13A 2-gang + 2 USB.

Can I assume that the USB sockets on these are actually switched and carry
no current until a plug is inserted?

If you have any experience of these things I would appreciate the benefit of
your know-how.


The MK sockets and the cabling in this house are over 40 years old,
just as compliant to modern regs,


I would not be 100% certain about that, but if they were fitted to reg's current at the time there is no requirement to update them.


and showing no sign of deterioration.

What are the chances of 5vDC from a Type 1 USB receptacle still being
a standard in 2057?


The 5V "standard" arises from the use of a 5V DC rail in TTL logic, which became widespread over fifty years ago. The voltage was chosen as it was easily obtained from the 6.3V AC commonly used for valve heater circuits from the mid 1930's.

5V is also the voltage of the main power bus in PC's even though modern CPU's and memory run at lower voltages.

Given it has already been around for over fifty years, I would not be surprised to see 5V connections in forty years time. After all the BS1363 interface was introduced in 1947 and is still current with minor adaptations despite fused plugs being bulky and largely irrelevant in installations with MCB's and RCD's in the consumer unit.


--

Graham.
%Profound_observation%


  #16  
Old October 8th 17, 02:22 PM posted to uk.tech.digital-tv
Max Demian
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 3,860
Default [OT] Dual-Gang switched 13A + USB sockets

On 08/10/2017 12:18, R. Mark Clayton wrote:
On Saturday, 7 October 2017 20:24:18 UTC+1, Graham. wrote:
On Thu, 05 Oct 2017 21:17:30 +0100, Pinnerite
coalesced the vapors of human experience into a viable and meaningful
comprehension...

I need to partially rewire my apartment. I am tempted to replace some old
double-switched sockets with those that incorporate USB sockets.

Some are described as Switched USB Socket 13A 2-gang + 2 USB.

Can I assume that the USB sockets on these are actually switched and carry
no current until a plug is inserted?

If you have any experience of these things I would appreciate the benefit of
your know-how.


The MK sockets and the cabling in this house are over 40 years old,
just as compliant to modern regs,


I would not be 100% certain about that, but if they were fitted to reg's current at the time there is no requirement to update them.


and showing no sign of deterioration.

What are the chances of 5vDC from a Type 1 USB receptacle still being
a standard in 2057?


The 5V "standard" arises from the use of a 5V DC rail in TTL logic, which became widespread over fifty years ago. The voltage was chosen as it was easily obtained from the 6.3V AC commonly used for valve heater circuits from the mid 1930's.

5V is also the voltage of the main power bus in PC's even though modern CPU's and memory run at lower voltages.

Given it has already been around for over fifty years, I would not be surprised to see 5V connections in forty years time. After all the BS1363 interface was introduced in 1947 and is still current with minor adaptations despite fused plugs being bulky and largely irrelevant in installations with MCB's and RCD's in the consumer unit.


We still need fuses in 13A plugs - though I would have thought it would
be better to fuse the socket - as most houses have ring mains with 30 or
32A fuses/circuit breakers.

--
Max Demian
  #17  
Old October 8th 17, 03:46 PM posted to uk.tech.digital-tv
Scott[_2_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 1,272
Default [OT] Dual-Gang switched 13A + USB sockets

On Sun, 8 Oct 2017 14:22:40 +0100, Max Demian
wrote:

On 08/10/2017 12:18, R. Mark Clayton wrote:
On Saturday, 7 October 2017 20:24:18 UTC+1, Graham. wrote:
On Thu, 05 Oct 2017 21:17:30 +0100, Pinnerite
coalesced the vapors of human experience into a viable and meaningful
comprehension...

I need to partially rewire my apartment. I am tempted to replace some old
double-switched sockets with those that incorporate USB sockets.

Some are described as Switched USB Socket 13A 2-gang + 2 USB.

Can I assume that the USB sockets on these are actually switched and carry
no current until a plug is inserted?

If you have any experience of these things I would appreciate the benefit of
your know-how.

The MK sockets and the cabling in this house are over 40 years old,
just as compliant to modern regs,


I would not be 100% certain about that, but if they were fitted to reg's current at the time there is no requirement to update them.


and showing no sign of deterioration.

What are the chances of 5vDC from a Type 1 USB receptacle still being
a standard in 2057?


The 5V "standard" arises from the use of a 5V DC rail in TTL logic, which became widespread over fifty years ago. The voltage was chosen as it was easily obtained from the 6.3V AC commonly used for valve heater circuits from the mid 1930's.

5V is also the voltage of the main power bus in PC's even though modern CPU's and memory run at lower voltages.

Given it has already been around for over fifty years, I would not be surprised to see 5V connections in forty years time. After all the BS1363 interface was introduced in 1947 and is still current with minor adaptations despite fused plugs being bulky and largely irrelevant in installations with MCB's and RCD's in the consumer unit.


We still need fuses in 13A plugs - though I would have thought it would
be better to fuse the socket - as most houses have ring mains with 30 or
32A fuses/circuit breakers.


In the 1950s way of thinking this would have meant some sockets would
be 3A, some 5A and some 13A. This is the direct opposite of what they
were trying to get away from - separate 5A and 15A round pin sockets.
  #18  
Old October 8th 17, 04:06 PM posted to uk.tech.digital-tv
Woody[_5_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 1,802
Default [OT] Dual-Gang switched 13A + USB sockets


"Scott" wrote in message
...
On Sun, 8 Oct 2017 14:22:40 +0100, Max Demian

wrote:

On 08/10/2017 12:18, R. Mark Clayton wrote:
On Saturday, 7 October 2017 20:24:18 UTC+1, Graham. wrote:
On Thu, 05 Oct 2017 21:17:30 +0100, Pinnerite

coalesced the vapors of human experience into a viable and
meaningful
comprehension...

I need to partially rewire my apartment. I am tempted to replace
some old
double-switched sockets with those that incorporate USB sockets.

Some are described as Switched USB Socket 13A 2-gang + 2 USB.

Can I assume that the USB sockets on these are actually switched
and carry
no current until a plug is inserted?

If you have any experience of these things I would appreciate
the benefit of
your know-how.

The MK sockets and the cabling in this house are over 40 years
old,
just as compliant to modern regs,

I would not be 100% certain about that, but if they were fitted to
reg's current at the time there is no requirement to update them.


and showing no sign of deterioration.

What are the chances of 5vDC from a Type 1 USB receptacle still
being
a standard in 2057?

The 5V "standard" arises from the use of a 5V DC rail in TTL
logic, which became widespread over fifty years ago. The voltage
was chosen as it was easily obtained from the 6.3V AC commonly
used for valve heater circuits from the mid 1930's.

5V is also the voltage of the main power bus in PC's even though
modern CPU's and memory run at lower voltages.

Given it has already been around for over fifty years, I would not
be surprised to see 5V connections in forty years time. After all
the BS1363 interface was introduced in 1947 and is still current
with minor adaptations despite fused plugs being bulky and largely
irrelevant in installations with MCB's and RCD's in the consumer
unit.


We still need fuses in 13A plugs - though I would have thought it
would
be better to fuse the socket - as most houses have ring mains with
30 or
32A fuses/circuit breakers.


In the 1950s way of thinking this would have meant some sockets
would
be 3A, some 5A and some 13A. This is the direct opposite of what
they
were trying to get away from - separate 5A and 15A round pin
sockets.


It was more about costs - we use single pole switching both on the
socket and (until of late) on the MCB as well. We thus put a fuse in
the live wire to make sure the live is killed in the event of a fault.

We have just had an extension built which was independently wired and
the electrician used RCBO's instead of a single RCD that would kill
everything in the event of a leak. The RCBO is a combined RCD and MCB
and kills both lines when it trips for any reason.


--
Woody

harrogate3 at ntlworld dot com


  #19  
Old October 8th 17, 04:16 PM posted to uk.tech.digital-tv
Andy Burns[_12_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 448
Default [OT] Dual-Gang switched 13A + USB sockets

Woody wrote:

The RCBO is a combined RCD and MCB and kills both lines when it trips
for any reason.

Both live and neutral pass *through* an RCBO (unlike live only for an
MCB) but I think they only break the live when they trip, certainly the
ones I've seen torn down, e.g.

https://youtu.be/gOUSDDLKICk


  #20  
Old October 8th 17, 04:24 PM posted to uk.tech.digital-tv
Scott[_2_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 1,272
Default [OT] Dual-Gang switched 13A + USB sockets

On Sun, 8 Oct 2017 16:06:40 +0100, "Woody"
wrote:


"Scott" wrote in message
.. .
On Sun, 8 Oct 2017 14:22:40 +0100, Max Demian

wrote:

On 08/10/2017 12:18, R. Mark Clayton wrote:
On Saturday, 7 October 2017 20:24:18 UTC+1, Graham. wrote:
On Thu, 05 Oct 2017 21:17:30 +0100, Pinnerite

coalesced the vapors of human experience into a viable and
meaningful
comprehension...

I need to partially rewire my apartment. I am tempted to replace
some old
double-switched sockets with those that incorporate USB sockets.

Some are described as Switched USB Socket 13A 2-gang + 2 USB.

Can I assume that the USB sockets on these are actually switched
and carry
no current until a plug is inserted?

If you have any experience of these things I would appreciate
the benefit of
your know-how.

The MK sockets and the cabling in this house are over 40 years
old,
just as compliant to modern regs,

I would not be 100% certain about that, but if they were fitted to
reg's current at the time there is no requirement to update them.


and showing no sign of deterioration.

What are the chances of 5vDC from a Type 1 USB receptacle still
being
a standard in 2057?

The 5V "standard" arises from the use of a 5V DC rail in TTL
logic, which became widespread over fifty years ago. The voltage
was chosen as it was easily obtained from the 6.3V AC commonly
used for valve heater circuits from the mid 1930's.

5V is also the voltage of the main power bus in PC's even though
modern CPU's and memory run at lower voltages.

Given it has already been around for over fifty years, I would not
be surprised to see 5V connections in forty years time. After all
the BS1363 interface was introduced in 1947 and is still current
with minor adaptations despite fused plugs being bulky and largely
irrelevant in installations with MCB's and RCD's in the consumer
unit.

We still need fuses in 13A plugs - though I would have thought it
would
be better to fuse the socket - as most houses have ring mains with
30 or
32A fuses/circuit breakers.


In the 1950s way of thinking this would have meant some sockets
would
be 3A, some 5A and some 13A. This is the direct opposite of what
they
were trying to get away from - separate 5A and 15A round pin
sockets.


It was more about costs - we use single pole switching both on the
socket and (until of late) on the MCB as well. We thus put a fuse in
the live wire to make sure the live is killed in the event of a fault.

We have just had an extension built which was independently wired and
the electrician used RCBO's instead of a single RCD that would kill
everything in the event of a leak. The RCBO is a combined RCD and MCB
and kills both lines when it trips for any reason.


I did the same. The electrician was quite appalled and said it would
be prohibitively expensive. I asked him for a price and he came back
and said it was far cheaper than the had expected and was the 'way to
go'. There is one for each circuit so a fault in one place won't trip
out the whole flat.
 




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