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uk.tech.digital-tv (Digital TV - General) (uk.tech.digital-tv) Discussion of all matters technical in origin related to the reception of digital television transmissions, be they via satellite, terrestrial or cable. Advertising is forbidden, with no exceptions.

Freesat?



 
 
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  #21  
Old June 2nd 17, 11:21 PM posted to uk.tech.digital-tv
Dave W
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 232
Default Freesat?


It's not quite true that you need two cables to record one channel while
watching another. With two you can record any channel and watch any other.
With one cable you can record any channel but you can only watch other
channels at the same time which happen to have the same combination of Hi/Lo
band and H/V polarisation as the one being recorded (4 permutations).

On BBC1 there are Scottish and Welsh versions as well as London, so If I am
prevented from viewing BBC1 London because of something else being recorded,
I can usually watch the Scottish or Welsh channel instead, which carry the
same programme as London for most of the time.

The Dave channel is not available on Freesat, but Talking Pictures is. On
Freeview the latter requires a HD decoder although the channel does not show
HD pictures.

If you use a separate recorder whose output feeds the TV, you must use a
HDMI cable not SCART, to see the picture in HD.
--
Dave W


  #22  
Old June 3rd 17, 07:48 AM posted to uk.tech.digital-tv
R. Mark Clayton[_2_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 434
Default Freesat?

On Friday, 2 June 2017 22:18:19 UTC+1, Mr Pounder Esquire wrote:
R. Mark Clayton wrote:
On Friday, 2 June 2017 16:20:33 UTC+1, Mr Pounder Esquire wrote:
R. Mark Clayton wrote:
On Friday, 2 June 2017 15:43:41 UTC+1, Mr Pounder Esquire wrote:

SNIP

Does the Freesat box just plug into the SKY dish connections?

Yes, apart from the newest duo ones. If the box also records you
will need two feeds.

There are two cables coming from the SKY dish and going into the
back of the SKY box. Will these be the two feeds?

Yes - the previous set up will have been Sky+

So, I'd plug both into a Freesat box then?


Only if it has two inputs [and can record - e.g. onto an internal
hard disk].


Understood and we have two inputs.


Then you should be able to record on the box to play back later.


All she wants to do is watch and record.

Many TV's will now record on USB, although to record full HD you
will probably need a USB pen drive. (still 64GB for £20 is pretty
cheap).

Seems that she could not care less about HD.


If you have an HD screen and she is not myopic she should soon
appreciate the difference.


We have a HD screen, I can't tell if the picture is HD or not. But I watch
very little television.


Digital SD was a significant improvement on analogue PAL.

You won't be watching HD unless

Your TV is full HD (1080i) AND
Your TV is fairly recent and has Freeview HD.
and / or
Your TV has a Freesat HD tuner.
and / or
You have a separate HD tuner and feed in via HDMI.

She has never moaned about the picture qualitity.


Go and see some in a shop - I recommend Richer Sounds. Indeed 4k is little more these days and would future proof a TV purchase.



Thanks.


  #23  
Old June 3rd 17, 09:05 AM posted to uk.tech.digital-tv
Brian Gaff
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Posts: 6,560
Default Freesat?

The main reason I've not gone down this route, or sky is because of the
patchy accessibility on the boxes. Nobody it seems has talking program
guides or menus and only upper range tvs have some talking features, but not
always the smart bits.
the whole thing is a minefield for the unwary blind person who wants

these features to be able to use the kit and wants audio description when
its available.


I once spoke to a designer of consumer electronics who recockoned that in
fact other than a little bit more ram, a talking tv or box is and has been
possible for years since most of them are in fact computers running software
very like an Android phone which has a built in screenreader called
talkback. The stumbling block is getting the front end apps and customer
facing menus to be accessible to this sort of software.
It can be very frustrating though, since in theory, if the developers built
it in from the start it would add little to a the unit cost at all!
Brian

--
----- -
This newsgroup posting comes to you directly from...
The Sofa of Brian Gaff...

Blind user, so no pictures please!
"R. Mark Clayton" wrote in message
...
On Friday, 2 June 2017 14:39:12 UTC+1, Mr Pounder Esquire wrote:
I know very little about TV and watch very little of it. Wife has it on
24/7.
We have had SKY for many many years.


You've been Murdoched.

The wife has just come back from a few days away in a holiday cottage and
was very impressed with the Freesat. She wants me to look into it :-(
So, here I go.
Is it all really free?


Yes and there are more FTA channels as well.

Do we really get all of these channels free? Not interested in On Demand.
http://cdn.freesat.co.uk/freesat/fre...201%202017.pdf

Not checked, there are a couple of hundred of them. Plus another hundred
or so FTA. Some replication (e.g. BBC and ITV regions) and dross
(religious and ad' channels).

If Freesat really is this good, why doesn't everybody have it instead of
SKY?


Good marketing by $ky.


Is it simple to use?


Yes for programs in the EPG.

Does the Freesat box just plug into the SKY dish connections?


Yes, apart from the newest duo ones. If the box also records you will
need two feeds.

Will the dish need pointing somewhere else?


No same position.

What would be a decent box to buy?


Any. Many TV's incorporate Freesat and many more contain an undocumented
FTA satellite receiver, but NOT the Freesat EPG (so all the programs, but
no glossy features like reserving etc.



Thanks.




  #24  
Old June 3rd 17, 09:05 AM posted to uk.tech.digital-tv
tim...[_2_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 377
Default Freesat?



"Dickie mint" wrote in message
...

One simple fact of Satellite that hasn't been mentioned and maybe needs
stressing is that a sky box receives exactly the same transmission as a
Freesat one. There are sky channels that are paid for, but these are on
the same satellites that the 'free' ones are!


The paid for ones are encrypted (and hence in the lingo are *not* FTA)

They are decoded by hardware in the Sky box, controlled by the little card
that they periodically send you that you have to insert in the slot on the
front of the box.

Theoretically, this encryption system should be "open", so that anyone can
make a box that decodes the signal and individual channels could sell subs
to just their channels.

But somehow Sky managed to get control of this process and if owners of the
channels want to receive revenue from encrypted viewing they have to provide
their services via a Sky bundle or add on.

There are also channels that are encrypted but free (that are called FTV -
Free to View). They do this because (I won't go into the details), it gives
them Geographically limited coverage.

These channels also need a Sky box and card to be decrypted, but not an
active subscription. Some people would use old Sky boxes and cards to
receive these channels. But that's hardly a long term strategy as you are
stuffed when the box breaks.

Now, I'm telling you that because it is only relatively recently that C4 and
C5 moved from being FTV to FTA, and even more recently that the UKTV (TM)
channels moved.

Someone who has had Sky for 20 years will probably be able to remember that
there were only about a dozen (mainstream UK) channels that could be
received with a non-Sky sat box and thus they subscribed to receive standard
UK TV.

But all that that has changed and the only channel that is now available via
Freeview and not on FreeSat is Dave (I think).

tim



  #25  
Old June 3rd 17, 09:20 AM posted to uk.tech.digital-tv
tim...[_2_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 377
Default Freesat?



"Woody" wrote in message
news
A little more explanation.

There is a cluster of satellites collectively named Astra sitting about
22700 miles above the equator (so they are geostationary) and 28.2deg east
of the meridian, so they are known collectively as Astra 28.2E. Even
though they are each 100 miles or so apart they are all within the
beamwidth (i.e. reception angle) of a satellite dish in the UK.

The basic channels - BBC, ITV, Ch4 and five - are all radiated from Astra
2F which has a very narrow footprint aimed at the UK. Time was that if you
lived north of the A69 (ish) you needed a Sky Zone 2 dish (equivalent to a
55cm ovoid dish) but since the move to 2F a few years ago the signal level
has increased so much that a zone 1 dish (approx 43cm ovoid) will work
anywhere. Sky subscription channels largely come from Astra 2A which is
higher power and covers much of western Europe - indeed Sky Eire is
transmitted from it.

You can use a Sky box to receive free-to-air (FTA) channels without paying
a subscription. If you already have a box and cease your Sky contract the
viewing card that you have will continue to work with the FTA channels.
The primary purpose of the card in this instance is to set channels 101
(BBC1) and 103 (ITV) to the correct region. If you use the box without a
card then you will get BBC1 London and ITV Central West on those channels.
However unless you pay Sky a tenner a month you will not be able to
record/playback, and indeed once your subscription has ceased you will not
be able to watch anything that you have already recorded off subscription
channels.

The advantage of Freesat-from-Sky (which is what you will have if you have
a F-f-S viewing card - once off 25 - or as possibly here an expired
viewing card) is that there are quite a few more FTA channels that are not
on non-Sky Freesat. A good example is Euronews which was withdrawn from
Freesat a few years ago by the owners. The disadvantage is that there are
some channels that are free on Freesat (and for that matter Freeview)
which are still behind the pay wall on Sky


There is nothing free on FreeSat that is behind the paywall on Sky, that's a
logically impossibility.

There are channels that are free on Freeview that are behind a paywall on
FreeSat (and that paywall is Sky)

tim



  #26  
Old June 3rd 17, 09:24 AM posted to uk.tech.digital-tv
tim...[_2_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 377
Default Freesat?



"Dave W" wrote in message
news

It's not quite true that you need two cables to record one channel while
watching another. With two you can record any channel and watch any other.
With one cable you can record any channel but you can only watch other
channels at the same time which happen to have the same combination of
Hi/Lo band and H/V polarisation as the one being recorded (4
permutations).


but you need a box that is capable

I've got the latest Humax Freesat box, which are usually the most feature
rich boxes available.

and if I am recording two channels it will let me watch a different channel
that is on the same polarisation - but ONLY if I was already watching it.

It will not let you move to a different channel on the same polarisation
even though it is obvious capable of decoding it

tim



  #27  
Old June 3rd 17, 09:25 AM posted to uk.tech.digital-tv
tim...[_2_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 377
Default Freesat?



"Graham." wrote in message
...



If you had sparkles, this must have been at least 17 years ago.


so what are these sparkles then?

tim



  #28  
Old June 3rd 17, 09:30 AM posted to uk.tech.digital-tv
tim...[_2_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 377
Default Freesat?



"Mr Pounder Esquire" wrote in message
news
R. Mark Clayton wrote:


If you have an HD screen and she is not myopic she should soon
appreciate the difference.


We have a HD screen, I can't tell if the picture is HD or not.


Me neither

and even if I could tell the difference I wouldn't give a **** about it

I watch TV programs to glean the information or entertainment value
contained within the program

That I can see individual blades of grass in the picture makes not one jot
of difference in that aim

What does make a difference is bloody subtitles that don't sync with the
sound. Getting that right is a million times more important than a sharper
picture (and it isn't just live subtitling that goes wrong!)

tim



  #29  
Old June 3rd 17, 09:37 AM posted to uk.tech.digital-tv
Mark Carver
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 7,556
Default Freesat?

On 03/06/2017 10:25, tim... wrote:


"Graham." wrote in message
...



If you had sparkles, this must have been at least 17 years ago.


so what are these sparkles then?


An artefact that appeared on weak FM modulated analogue video signals.


--
Mark
Please replace invalid and invalid with gmx and net to reply.
  #30  
Old June 3rd 17, 11:42 AM posted to uk.tech.digital-tv
tim...[_2_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 377
Default Freesat?



"Martin" wrote in message
...
On Fri, 2 Jun 2017 19:36:04 +0100, "Woody"
wrote:

A little more explanation.

There is a cluster of satellites collectively named Astra sitting
about 22700 miles above the equator (so they are geostationary) and
28.2deg east of the meridian, so they are known collectively as Astra
28.2E. Even though they are each 100 miles or so apart they are all
within the beamwidth (i.e. reception angle) of a satellite dish in the
UK.

The basic channels - BBC, ITV, Ch4 and five - are all radiated from
Astra 2F which has a very narrow footprint aimed at the UK. Time was
that if you lived north of the A69 (ish) you needed a Sky Zone 2 dish
(equivalent to a 55cm ovoid dish) but since the move to 2F a few years
ago the signal level has increased so much that a zone 1 dish (approx
43cm ovoid) will work anywhere. Sky subscription channels largely come
from Astra 2A which is higher power and covers much of western
Europe - indeed Sky Eire is transmitted from it.

You can use a Sky box to receive free-to-air (FTA) channels without
paying a subscription. If you already have a box and cease your Sky
contract the viewing card that you have will continue to work with the
FTA channels. The primary purpose of the card in this instance is to
set channels 101 (BBC1) and 103 (ITV) to the correct region. If you
use the box without a card then you will get BBC1 London and ITV
Central West on those channels. However unless you pay Sky a tenner a
month you will not be able to record/playback, and indeed once your
subscription has ceased you will not be able to watch anything that
you have already recorded off subscription channels.

The advantage of Freesat-from-Sky (which is what you will have if you
have a F-f-S viewing card - once off 25 - or as possibly here an
expired viewing card) is that there are quite a few more FTA channels
that are not on non-Sky Freesat. A good example is Euronews which was
withdrawn from Freesat a few years ago by the owners. The disadvantage
is that there are some channels that are free on Freesat (and for that
matter Freeview) which are still behind the pay wall on Sky - for
example Dave and some of the +1 channels.

If you get a Freesat recorder then it will work essentially the same
as you have now with subscription Sky, i.e. you will need a dual (or
more) output LNB and two cables to the box. If you already have Sky
with recording then the box is a straight swap. Have a look at the
Manager's Specials on www.humaxdirect.co.uk for some good prices. Note
that Freesat channel numbers are different from the same stations on
Freesat-from-Sky and both are different from Freeview.

To sum up:

Freeview is terrestrial TV through your aerial and needs only a TV and
a PVR if you want to record. You can record two different channels at
once off one aerial whilst watching a recording. You will need a TV
with HD tuner (all TV's sold in the last two years and of 32" screen
or bigger should have one as standard) to watch HD programmes. Almost
any PVR has a HD tuner as standard and can be used with a TV that is
capable of HD in some format effectively replacing the TV tuner.

Freesat is more or less Freeview but from a satellite via a dish
rather than a TV aerial.


but with more HD channels according to people posting here.


more normal channels as well

I watch programs from Forces TV, Talking Pictures & PSB America, none of
which are available on my FreeView box (TP is available on FV if you have
COM 7&8 from your Tx, but I don't)

tim



 




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