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700 MHz clearance starts March 1



 
 
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  #31  
Old February 5th 17, 02:39 PM posted to uk.tech.digital-tv
Mark Carver
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 7,556
Default 700 MHz clearance starts March 1

On 05/02/2017 15:17, Robin wrote:

As usual that's v interesting - albeit way above my head technically.
Dare I ask though if there's any other way to provide on-screen messages
given DigitalUK's briefing refers to "An information campaign to help
prepare viewers, including local advertising and on-screen messages,
will commence from mid-February 2017."


My guess is that Border ITV's Selkirk sub region might carry on screen
notices and ads, (because that region only addresses Selkirk, and not
the wider Scottish network).

As the ITV mux will not be affected, that might make sense, as some
viewers may well completely lose the BBC mux after March 28th ?

I can't see BBC Scotland putting up captions, because for them they will
appear on the whole Scottish Tx network, and will cause confusion. I
suspect however they might carry the same 'ads' which can illustrate
with a map who's affected etc.

--
Mark
Please replace invalid and invalid with gmx and net to reply.
  #32  
Old February 5th 17, 02:42 PM posted to uk.tech.digital-tv
Woody[_5_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 1,660
Default 700 MHz clearance starts March 1


"Robin" wrote in message
...
On 05/02/2017 14:12, Mark Carver wrote:
On 04/02/2017 21:39, Woody wrote:

How would they do that, given that Selkirk is in the same BBC
code/mux SIPSI pool as the rest of Scotland ? Any caption would
(probably) have
to be inserted within the SDI domian in the CCM centres, and
would
be visible on all Scottish transmitters ?


That is exactly what we did on DSO.


Err no you didn't.

There is a caption generator on
site - don't ask me how it works - that is networked from Emley
where
they can inject text, and that text only goes out on that site,
not on
the relays.


Yes, it was a 1RU Softel box, that keyed in the caption, and was
remote
controlled via VBI commands, as well remote controllable via
telemetry,
Easy, because the baseband composite video signal was available, on
the
PIE/TIE bays.

With DTT, more or less the entire transport stream for each mux is
remotely assembled, all the channels are wrapped up into the
stream.
The only way to insert captions would be to decode each one, insert
a
caption in the SDI domain, then re encode, very involved, and would
have a terrible effect on quality.

As said inserting would have to be way upstream at the CCM centres,
and
then a special SIPSI coded pool generated for just Selkirk.

The only likely method would be an MHEG caption, triggered off by
addressing the particular SIDs etc at Selkirk. You'd need
to generate new SIDs just for Selkirk though, and that would
require a viewer re tune to enable it. Perhaps, after March 1st
when the E32 version of the mux appears, there might be an
opportunity
to change the SIDs on the E50 version, to give captions on there.
Whatever, I doubt any captions will/have appeared before Mar 1st



As usual that's v interesting - albeit way above my head
technically. Dare I ask though if there's any other way to provide
on-screen messages given DigitalUK's briefing refers to "An
information campaign to help prepare viewers, including local
advertising and on-screen messages, will commence from mid-February
2017."



Had a mail from my cousin in Peebles this morning. They knew nothing
of it and as yet there has been no local publicity.

As Mark asked, will they even bother?


--
Woody

harrogate3 at ntlworld dot com


  #33  
Old February 5th 17, 02:44 PM posted to uk.tech.digital-tv
Sam
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 12
Default 700 MHz clearance starts March 1

On 05/02/2017 14:02, tim... wrote:


"Ian Jackson" wrote in message
news

Is there no facility to do a manual tune - or is this a feature that
someone has decided we no longer need?


well obviously there is, otherwise you wouldn't be able to retune when
you move house

tim



It isn't obvious. The facility for manual tuning, ie channel by channel
tunung, could be removed from the menu if the mfg wanted to simplify it.
It doesn't follow that automatic tuning would be removed as well.


  #34  
Old February 5th 17, 03:04 PM posted to uk.tech.digital-tv
Robin[_8_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 392
Default 700 MHz clearance starts March 1

On 05/02/2017 15:39, Mark Carver wrote:
On 05/02/2017 15:17, Robin wrote:

As usual that's v interesting - albeit way above my head technically.
Dare I ask though if there's any other way to provide on-screen messages
given DigitalUK's briefing refers to "An information campaign to help
prepare viewers, including local advertising and on-screen messages,
will commence from mid-February 2017."


My guess is that Border ITV's Selkirk sub region might carry on screen
notices and ads, (because that region only addresses Selkirk, and not
the wider Scottish network).

As the ITV mux will not be affected, that might make sense, as some
viewers may well completely lose the BBC mux after March 28th ?

I can't see BBC Scotland putting up captions, because for them they will
appear on the whole Scottish Tx network, and will cause confusion. I
suspect however they might carry the same 'ads' which can illustrate
with a map who's affected etc.


Thanks.

--
Robin
reply-to address is (intended to be) valid
  #35  
Old February 5th 17, 03:12 PM posted to uk.tech.digital-tv
Robin[_8_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 392
Default 700 MHz clearance starts March 1

On 05/02/2017 15:42, Woody wrote:

As usual that's v interesting - albeit way above my head
technically. Dare I ask though if there's any other way to provide
on-screen messages given DigitalUK's briefing refers to "An
information campaign to help prepare viewers, including local
advertising and on-screen messages, will commence from mid-February
2017."



Had a mail from my cousin in Peebles this morning. They knew nothing
of it and as yet there has been no local publicity.

As Mark asked, will they even bother?


Ask your cousin again when mid-February arrives. But truly stupid to
annoucne soemthign like that if they can't deliover it.


--
Robin
reply-to address is (intended to be) valid
  #36  
Old February 5th 17, 03:13 PM posted to uk.tech.digital-tv
charles[_2_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 531
Default 700 MHz clearance starts March 1

In article ,
Woody wrote:

"Robin" wrote in message
...
On 05/02/2017 14:12, Mark Carver wrote:
On 04/02/2017 21:39, Woody wrote:

How would they do that, given that Selkirk is in the same BBC
code/mux SIPSI pool as the rest of Scotland ? Any caption would
(probably) have
to be inserted within the SDI domian in the CCM centres, and
would
be visible on all Scottish transmitters ?

That is exactly what we did on DSO.

Err no you didn't.

There is a caption generator on
site - don't ask me how it works - that is networked from Emley
where
they can inject text, and that text only goes out on that site,
not on
the relays.

Yes, it was a 1RU Softel box, that keyed in the caption, and was
remote
controlled via VBI commands, as well remote controllable via
telemetry,
Easy, because the baseband composite video signal was available, on
the
PIE/TIE bays.

With DTT, more or less the entire transport stream for each mux is
remotely assembled, all the channels are wrapped up into the
stream.
The only way to insert captions would be to decode each one, insert
a
caption in the SDI domain, then re encode, very involved, and would
have a terrible effect on quality.

As said inserting would have to be way upstream at the CCM centres,
and
then a special SIPSI coded pool generated for just Selkirk.

The only likely method would be an MHEG caption, triggered off by
addressing the particular SIDs etc at Selkirk. You'd need
to generate new SIDs just for Selkirk though, and that would
require a viewer re tune to enable it. Perhaps, after March 1st
when the E32 version of the mux appears, there might be an
opportunity
to change the SIDs on the E50 version, to give captions on there.
Whatever, I doubt any captions will/have appeared before Mar 1st



As usual that's v interesting - albeit way above my head
technically. Dare I ask though if there's any other way to provide
on-screen messages given DigitalUK's briefing refers to "An
information campaign to help prepare viewers, including local
advertising and on-screen messages, will commence from mid-February
2017."



Had a mail from my cousin in Peebles this morning. They knew nothing
of it and as yet there has been no local publicity.


Peebles has its own relay. While its input channels will change the output
ones won't

--
from KT24 in Surrey, England
  #37  
Old February 5th 17, 03:29 PM posted to uk.tech.digital-tv
Mark Carver
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 7,556
Default 700 MHz clearance starts March 1

On 05/02/2017 16:13, charles wrote:


Peebles has its own relay. While its input channels will change the output
ones won't


Indeed, and the only way for Peebles not to get any captions that they
might be able to insert on Selkirk, might be the MHEG method, but I've
not even sure whether the relays will just 'dumbly' carry the same SIDs,
unless they can be tied to specific UHF channels too ?



--
Mark
Please replace invalid and invalid with gmx and net to reply.
  #38  
Old February 5th 17, 04:58 PM posted to uk.tech.digital-tv
johnt
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 4
Default 700 MHz clearance starts March 1


"Jim Lesurf" wrote in message
...

When there is a change, our TV tells us a 're-tune' is needed when
switched
on. If we choose to not 're-tune' it tells us again every time it is
swiched on until we do a 're-tune'. So despite not being interested in the
actual changes or needing the wonders of yet another crap station we end
up
being nagged into re-tuning. Can't find any way to tell the TV to stop
this
behaviour.


You shouldn't have purchased a cheap TV.
--
JohnT

  #39  
Old February 5th 17, 04:59 PM posted to uk.tech.digital-tv
Woody[_5_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 1,660
Default 700 MHz clearance starts March 1


"charles" wrote in message
...
In article ,
Woody wrote:

"Robin" wrote in message
...
On 05/02/2017 14:12, Mark Carver wrote:
On 04/02/2017 21:39, Woody wrote:

How would they do that, given that Selkirk is in the same BBC
code/mux SIPSI pool as the rest of Scotland ? Any caption
would
(probably) have
to be inserted within the SDI domian in the CCM centres, and
would
be visible on all Scottish transmitters ?

That is exactly what we did on DSO.

Err no you didn't.

There is a caption generator on
site - don't ask me how it works - that is networked from Emley
where
they can inject text, and that text only goes out on that site,
not on
the relays.

Yes, it was a 1RU Softel box, that keyed in the caption, and was
remote
controlled via VBI commands, as well remote controllable via
telemetry,
Easy, because the baseband composite video signal was available,
on
the
PIE/TIE bays.

With DTT, more or less the entire transport stream for each mux
is
remotely assembled, all the channels are wrapped up into the
stream.
The only way to insert captions would be to decode each one,
insert
a
caption in the SDI domain, then re encode, very involved, and
would
have a terrible effect on quality.

As said inserting would have to be way upstream at the CCM
centres,
and
then a special SIPSI coded pool generated for just Selkirk.

The only likely method would be an MHEG caption, triggered off
by
addressing the particular SIDs etc at Selkirk. You'd need
to generate new SIDs just for Selkirk though, and that would
require a viewer re tune to enable it. Perhaps, after March 1st
when the E32 version of the mux appears, there might be an
opportunity
to change the SIDs on the E50 version, to give captions on
there.
Whatever, I doubt any captions will/have appeared before Mar 1st



As usual that's v interesting - albeit way above my head
technically. Dare I ask though if there's any other way to
provide
on-screen messages given DigitalUK's briefing refers to "An
information campaign to help prepare viewers, including local
advertising and on-screen messages, will commence from
mid-February
2017."



Had a mail from my cousin in Peebles this morning. They knew
nothing
of it and as yet there has been no local publicity.


Peebles has its own relay. While its input channels will change the
output
ones won't


Yes but it will be off air whilst the transposer unit is reprogrammed
and a different Rx filter put in place, and then readings taken and
confirmed.


--
Woody

harrogate3 at ntlworld dot com


  #40  
Old February 5th 17, 05:05 PM posted to uk.tech.digital-tv
charles[_2_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 531
Default 700 MHz clearance starts March 1

In article , Woody
wrote:

"charles" wrote in message
...
In article , Woody
wrote:

"Robin" wrote in message
...
On 05/02/2017 14:12, Mark Carver wrote:
On 04/02/2017 21:39, Woody wrote:

How would they do that, given that Selkirk is in the same BBC
code/mux SIPSI pool as the rest of Scotland ? Any caption would
(probably) have to be inserted within the SDI domian in the CCM
centres, and would be visible on all Scottish transmitters ?

That is exactly what we did on DSO.

Err no you didn't.

There is a caption generator on site - don't ask me how it works -
that is networked from Emley where they can inject text, and that
text only goes out on that site, not on the relays.

Yes, it was a 1RU Softel box, that keyed in the caption, and was
remote controlled via VBI commands, as well remote controllable via
telemetry, Easy, because the baseband composite video signal was
available, on the PIE/TIE bays.

With DTT, more or less the entire transport stream for each mux is
remotely assembled, all the channels are wrapped up into the
stream. The only way to insert captions would be to decode each
one, insert a caption in the SDI domain, then re encode, very
involved, and would have a terrible effect on quality.

As said inserting would have to be way upstream at the CCM
centres, and then a special SIPSI coded pool generated for just
Selkirk.

The only likely method would be an MHEG caption, triggered off by
addressing the particular SIDs etc at Selkirk. You'd need to
generate new SIDs just for Selkirk though, and that would require a
viewer re tune to enable it. Perhaps, after March 1st when the E32
version of the mux appears, there might be an opportunity to change
the SIDs on the E50 version, to give captions on there. Whatever,
I doubt any captions will/have appeared before Mar 1st



As usual that's v interesting - albeit way above my head
technically. Dare I ask though if there's any other way to provide
on-screen messages given DigitalUK's briefing refers to "An
information campaign to help prepare viewers, including local
advertising and on-screen messages, will commence from mid-February
2017."



Had a mail from my cousin in Peebles this morning. They knew nothing
of it and as yet there has been no local publicity.


Peebles has its own relay. While its input channels will change the
output ones won't


Yes but it will be off air whilst the transposer unit is reprogrammed
and a different Rx filter put in place, and then readings taken and
confirmed.


of course, but the individual viewers won't need to do anything to their
aerials. (except curse them when the signal unaccountably fails)

--
from KT24 in Surrey, England
 




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