A Sky, cable and digital tv forum. Digital TV Banter

If this is your first visit, be sure to check out the FAQ by clicking the link above. You may have to register before you can post: click the register link above to proceed. To start viewing messages, select the forum that you want to visit from the selection below.

Go Back   Home » Digital TV Banter forum » Digital TV Newsgroups » uk.tech.digital-tv (Digital TV - General)
Site Map Home Register Authors List Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read Web Partners

uk.tech.digital-tv (Digital TV - General) (uk.tech.digital-tv) Discussion of all matters technical in origin related to the reception of digital television transmissions, be they via satellite, terrestrial or cable. Advertising is forbidden, with no exceptions.

700 MHz clearance starts March 1



 
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #11  
Old February 4th 17, 05:14 PM posted to uk.tech.digital-tv
Brian Gaff
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 6,954
Default 700 MHz clearance starts March 1

Nobody cares any more obviously. somebody out there probably knows that the
terrestrial bands days are numbered. As many have said before, Murphy has
his law which will mean just when all terrestrial tv has gone, a huge solare
storm will fy all the satalites.
Then what will they all do? Hastily sting up fibre cables into all the
Virgin hubs and we all have to pay?
Brian

--
----- -
This newsgroup posting comes to you directly from...
The Sofa of Brian Gaff...

Blind user, so no pictures please!
"Mark Carver" wrote in message
...
At Selkirk, for BBC A.

Nice of Ofcom et al to give plenty of notice (less than 4 weeks)
that many viewers' aerials will require replacement (at the viewer's
own expense ?).

http://www.digitaluk.co.uk/__data/assets/pdf_file/0013/92011/Selkirk_700MHz_clearance_briefing_from_Digital_UK. pdf


--
Mark
Please replace invalid and invalid with gmx and net to reply.



  #12  
Old February 4th 17, 05:20 PM posted to uk.tech.digital-tv
Brian Gaff
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 6,954
Default 700 MHz clearance starts March 1

And that little bit that we all used to avoid where radar interference was
often found and we all tuned our outputs of our vcrs to which soo was used
anyway, called the gap or something. I read the offcom report about all
this and to be frank, it confused the heck out of me as to what is going on.
I'd suggest mucho crossmod interference if they go ahead with all of this
wiide band data stuff.
What a messy muddle they are making.
Brian

--
----- -
This newsgroup posting comes to you directly from...
The Sofa of Brian Gaff...

Blind user, so no pictures please!
"Scott" wrote in message
...
On Sat, 4 Feb 2017 10:20:00 -0000, "NY" wrote:

"Scott" wrote in message
. ..
On Sat, 4 Feb 2017 09:48:43 +0000, Mark Carver
wrote:

At Selkirk, for BBC A.

Nice of Ofcom et al to give plenty of notice (less than 4 weeks)
that many viewers' aerials will require replacement (at the viewer's
own expense ?).

http://www.digitaluk.co.uk/__data/assets/pdf_file/0013/92011/Selkirk_700MHz_clearance_briefing_from_Digital_UK. pdf

When they say 'a small proportion of group C/D aerials may need to be
updated', do they mean a small proportion of all the aerials (ie,
those that are group C/D) or do they meal all group C/D aerials?


Should read 'mean'.

Also what is 'T (wideband)'? I thought 'W' was wideband.


When new aerials are fitted nowadays, are they still tuned to a range of
channels (even if not as small a range as they used to be) or are they all
wideband nowadays, suitable for whatever changes Ofcom may make in the
future?


That's an interesting question. Are the new 'wideband' aerials less
'wide' than they used to be if Ofcom have chopped off the top part of
the spectrum?



  #13  
Old February 4th 17, 05:27 PM posted to uk.tech.digital-tv
Brian Gaff
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 6,954
Default 700 MHz clearance starts March 1

From a conversation I had with ofcom a year or so back, about something else
entirely it was suggested that in fact the sd channels will be piggy backing
on 'spare' capacity on the HD muxs in the main. In fact this seems to be
already happening for some channels. one of the London CBs/Sony channels
disappeared from non hd boxes and sets some time last year and I'm informed
this is what has happened to that. So if that is what is happening it will
spell the end of the Smart talk box for the blind with the talking program
guide.
OK its old now, but many are still in use as what is the point of hd to us?
Brian

--
----- -
This newsgroup posting comes to you directly from...
The Sofa of Brian Gaff...

Blind user, so no pictures please!
"Scott" wrote in message
news
On Sat, 4 Feb 2017 11:04:14 -0000, "Woody"
wrote:


"NY" wrote in message
news:[email protected] .co.uk...
"Scott" wrote in message
...
On Sat, 4 Feb 2017 09:48:43 +0000, Mark Carver
wrote:

At Selkirk, for BBC A.

Nice of Ofcom et al to give plenty of notice (less than 4 weeks)
that many viewers' aerials will require replacement (at the
viewer's
own expense ?).

http://www.digitaluk.co.uk/__data/assets/pdf_file/0013/92011/Selkirk_700MHz_clearance_briefing_from_Digital_UK. pdf

When they say 'a small proportion of group C/D aerials may need to
be
updated', do they mean a small proportion of all the aerials (ie,
those that are group C/D) or do they meal all group C/D aerials?

Also what is 'T (wideband)'? I thought 'W' was wideband.

When new aerials are fitted nowadays, are they still tuned to a
range of channels (even if not as small a range as they used to be)
or are they all wideband nowadays, suitable for whatever changes
Ofcom may make in the future?


Actually they have dropped one there. W is wideband - 21-68 - whereas
T-band is 21-60 which is what ought to be being used almost everywhere
since 800MHz was cleared.

What they should have advised is K-band (which may or may not be
available) which is 21-48 (so 49 won't be a problem) that now ought to
be the preferred post 700MHz clearance.


Interesting. On a note of self-interest, struggling to find any
details for Blackhill. I have a Group B aerial at present. I am
hoping I may be okay as the drift seems to be in a downward direction.
(The reality is if I keep the main HD multiplex nothing else matters
greatly!)



  #14  
Old February 4th 17, 05:30 PM posted to uk.tech.digital-tv
Mark Carver
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 7,594
Default 700 MHz clearance starts March 1

On 04/02/2017 11:00, Woody wrote:
"Mark Carver" wrote in message
...
At Selkirk, for BBC A.

Nice of Ofcom et al to give plenty of notice (less than 4 weeks)
that many viewers' aerials will require replacement (at the viewer's
own expense ?).

http://www.digitaluk.co.uk/__data/assets/pdf_file/0013/92011/Selkirk_700MHz_clearance_briefing_from_Digital_UK. pdf


Except that neither you nor I can see Selkirk transmissions. There may
well be one of those caption boxes on the bottom of the screen warning
about the channel change that has been there for some time.


How would they do that, given that Selkirk is in the same BBC code/mux
SIPSI pool as the rest of Scotland ? Any caption would (probably) have
to be inserted within the SDI domian in the CCM centres, and would be
visible on all Scottish transmitters ?


--
Mark
Please replace invalid and invalid with gmx and net to reply.
  #15  
Old February 4th 17, 05:30 PM posted to uk.tech.digital-tv
Brian Gaff
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 6,954
Default 700 MHz clearance starts March 1

Will not all this cramming into the one part give lots of problems when
another uhf lift occurs though? The whole idea of using frequencies a long
way apart at nearby locations was to stop this problem happening.
Brian

--
----- -
This newsgroup posting comes to you directly from...
The Sofa of Brian Gaff...

Blind user, so no pictures please!
"Woody" wrote in message
news

"Scott" wrote in message
news
On Sat, 4 Feb 2017 11:04:14 -0000, "Woody"
wrote:


"NY" wrote in message
news:[email protected] w.co.uk...
"Scott" wrote in message
...
On Sat, 4 Feb 2017 09:48:43 +0000, Mark Carver
wrote:

At Selkirk, for BBC A.

Nice of Ofcom et al to give plenty of notice (less than 4 weeks)
that many viewers' aerials will require replacement (at the
viewer's
own expense ?).

http://www.digitaluk.co.uk/__data/assets/pdf_file/0013/92011/Selkirk_700MHz_clearance_briefing_from_Digital_UK. pdf

When they say 'a small proportion of group C/D aerials may need to
be
updated', do they mean a small proportion of all the aerials (ie,
those that are group C/D) or do they meal all group C/D aerials?

Also what is 'T (wideband)'? I thought 'W' was wideband.

When new aerials are fitted nowadays, are they still tuned to a
range of channels (even if not as small a range as they used to be)
or are they all wideband nowadays, suitable for whatever changes
Ofcom may make in the future?

Actually they have dropped one there. W is wideband - 21-68 - whereas
T-band is 21-60 which is what ought to be being used almost everywhere
since 800MHz was cleared.

What they should have advised is K-band (which may or may not be
available) which is 21-48 (so 49 won't be a problem) that now ought to
be the preferred post 700MHz clearance.


Interesting. On a note of self-interest, struggling to find any
details for Blackhill. I have a Group B aerial at present. I am
hoping I may be okay as the drift seems to be in a downward direction.
(The reality is if I keep the main HD multiplex nothing else matters
greatly!)


You really need to go to wideband as BH uses 51 for local TV which will
have to move, but already has Com7/8 down in the 30's.



--
Woody

harrogate3 at ntlworld dot com



  #16  
Old February 4th 17, 05:32 PM posted to uk.tech.digital-tv
Mark Carver
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 7,594
Default 700 MHz clearance starts March 1

On 04/02/2017 17:30, Brian Gaff wrote:
Will not all this cramming into the one part give lots of problems when
another uhf lift occurs though? The whole idea of using frequencies a long
way apart at nearby locations was to stop this problem happening.


Yep, there will be inevitably be a reduction of protection ratios, and
therefore more 'downtime' during lift conditions.


--
Mark
Please replace invalid and invalid with gmx and net to reply.
  #17  
Old February 4th 17, 05:37 PM posted to uk.tech.digital-tv
Mark Carver
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 7,594
Default 700 MHz clearance starts March 1

On 04/02/2017 13:47, Paul Ratcliffe wrote:
On Sat, 4 Feb 2017 09:48:43 +0000, Mark Carver wrote:

At Selkirk, for BBC A.

Nice of Ofcom et al to give plenty of notice (less than 4 weeks)
that many viewers' aerials will require replacement (at the viewer's
own expense ?).

http://www.digitaluk.co.uk/__data/assets/pdf_file/0013/92011/Selkirk_700MHz_clearance_briefing_from_Digital_UK. pdf


So their "Current accelerated clearance plan (Sep 2016)" at:
http://www.digitaluk.co.uk/__data/assets/pdf_file/0014/92021/Ofcom_map_of_D23_700MHz_clearance_rollout_plan.pdf
is complete ******** then?

That has the Selkirk and surrounding areas not moving until Q3/4 2019.


I presume the other 5 muxes at Selkirk won't move until then ?

They really are storing up trouble. If some Group C/D aerials
do happen to work at E32, there's no guarantee they will for
the other five out of band allocations planned for 2019

And what in the world does "D23" mean?


Probably 'Draft number 23'

Useless lumps, the lot of them.


We're no longer viewers, just 'end users'.


--
Mark
Please replace invalid and invalid with gmx and net to reply.
  #18  
Old February 4th 17, 06:04 PM posted to uk.tech.digital-tv
Mark Carver
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 7,594
Default 700 MHz clearance starts March 1

On 04/02/2017 12:52, Woody wrote:

You really need to go to wideband as BH uses 51 for local TV which
will have to move, but already has Com7/8 down in the 30's.


Except if you read the stuff from Ofcom there is a plan (TBC) to
temporarily park COM 7 and 8 (nationally for all thirty sites) at E55
and E56



--
Mark
Please replace invalid and invalid with gmx and net to reply.
  #19  
Old February 4th 17, 09:39 PM posted to uk.tech.digital-tv
Woody[_5_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 1,797
Default 700 MHz clearance starts March 1


"Mark Carver" wrote in message
...
On 04/02/2017 11:00, Woody wrote:
"Mark Carver" wrote in message
...
At Selkirk, for BBC A.

Nice of Ofcom et al to give plenty of notice (less than 4 weeks)
that many viewers' aerials will require replacement (at the
viewer's
own expense ?).

http://www.digitaluk.co.uk/__data/assets/pdf_file/0013/92011/Selkirk_700MHz_clearance_briefing_from_Digital_UK. pdf


Except that neither you nor I can see Selkirk transmissions. There
may
well be one of those caption boxes on the bottom of the screen
warning
about the channel change that has been there for some time.


How would they do that, given that Selkirk is in the same BBC
code/mux SIPSI pool as the rest of Scotland ? Any caption would
(probably) have
to be inserted within the SDI domian in the CCM centres, and would
be visible on all Scottish transmitters ?



That is exactly what we did on DSO. There is a caption generator on
site - don't ask me how it works - that is networked from Emley where
they can inject text, and that text only goes out on that site, not on
the relays.


--
Woody

harrogate3 at ntlworld dot com


  #20  
Old February 5th 17, 09:02 AM posted to uk.tech.digital-tv
Ian Jackson[_6_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 48
Default 700 MHz clearance starts March 1

In message , Mark Carver
writes
On 04/02/2017 17:30, Brian Gaff wrote:
Will not all this cramming into the one part give lots of problems when
another uhf lift occurs though? The whole idea of using frequencies a long
way apart at nearby locations was to stop this problem happening.


Yep, there will be inevitably be a reduction of protection ratios, and
therefore more 'downtime' during lift conditions.


Does digital need so great a protection ratio?

With analogue, you can start seeing co-channel at around -45dB. With
digital, surely it's a lot less (-20dB?) - but it's a case of 'now see
the wanted picture - now you don't'.



--
Ian
 




Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

vB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump


All times are GMT. The time now is 01:06 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.6.4
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.SEO by vBSEO 2.4.0
Copyright 2004-2017 Digital TV Banter.
The comments are property of their posters.