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Freesat+ EPG



 
 
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  #11  
Old November 16th 16, 09:38 AM posted to uk.tech.digital-tv
tim...[_2_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 319
Default Freesat+ EPG


"pamela" wrote in message
...
On 19:10 15 Nov 2016, tim... wrote:


"pamela" wrote in message
...
On 09:56 15 Nov 2016, Martin wrote:

There are reviews of the HDR 1100S here

https://www.amazon.co.uk/product-
reviews/B0104SYAO4/ref=cm_cr_arp
_d_hist_2?ie=UTF8&filterByStar=two_star&showViewpo ints=
0&pageNumber=1

The majority are 5 star. The one star reviews seem to be
defective boxes.

In some ways I preferred the old Foxsat box. We've had the HDR
1100S box since mid August 2016, after the receivers on the
Foxsat box died.

I bought ours from Richer Sounds. The box contained nether a
Richer Sounds nor a Humax guarantee. Been back and got the
free 6 years guarantee that Richer Sounds advertised.

We've had an occasional problem. A couple of times it went
into hibernation mode while we were watching. It forgets the
subtitle setting - it turns it off. We get this about once a
week It turns on the audio description, maybe once a month. I
find the font used in the programme info too small. I can't
find a quick way to locate channels. Forwarding/Rewind works
like a Sky box now. Foxsat allowed one to step forward in user
defined time steps. We've had a couple of programmes that
didn;t record, but I think it was because there was a clash. I
miss not being able to see which channels are being recorded,
without having to go via the menu to recorded programmes.

Most of those reviews for the HDR 1100S were positive but a
non-trivial number of people gave very negative reviews based
on some nasty sounding problems.


apart from the restart problem that I mentioned, none of the
issues with my, what is actually the 1010s is a bug

they are just annoyances.

It takes more key presses to do a particular task than the 9150
takes. Sometimes considerably more.

Martin mentioned the problem with displaying the current live
recordings (something which you might wish to do to stop the
recording early)

there are a dozen other little things like that

tim


What about those problems on the HDR-1000S I picked out from an
Amazon review? Have they been fixed or maybe they were sorted out for
the HDR-1100S?

I mean these: no bookmarking,


Well this is just one of those annoying missing features that now requires
extra key presses.

If you want to navigate to a particular place in a recording, you just have
to press skip forwards many times.

I only ever used the bookmark feature on my 9150 on the occasions that I
started to playback a program before the recording had completed and then
wanted to stop playback. Then 9150 then loses the place you had got to and
starts again from the beginning next time you play back. The 1010 doesn't
have this bug and always remembers the place that you stopped at (provided
that you stop playback properly).

slow channel changes,


not noticed

no
slow-motion playback,


missing feature, not a bug

unfriendly menus,


well this is the point that I made. The UI IS crap.

doesn't record if you
press record mid-program.


This is fixed (if it ever were broken)

tim





  #12  
Old November 16th 16, 09:50 AM posted to uk.tech.digital-tv
tim...[_2_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 319
Default Freesat+ EPG


"Martin" wrote in message
...
On Tue, 15 Nov 2016 21:13:57 GMT, pamela wrote:

On 19:10 15 Nov 2016, tim... wrote:


"pamela" wrote in message
...
On 09:56 15 Nov 2016, Martin wrote:

There are reviews of the HDR 1100S here

https://www.amazon.co.uk/product-
reviews/B0104SYAO4/ref=cm_cr_arp
_d_hist_2?ie=UTF8&filterByStar=two_star&showViewpo ints=
0&pageNumber=1

The majority are 5 star. The one star reviews seem to be
defective boxes.

In some ways I preferred the old Foxsat box. We've had the HDR
1100S box since mid August 2016, after the receivers on the
Foxsat box died.

I bought ours from Richer Sounds. The box contained nether a
Richer Sounds nor a Humax guarantee. Been back and got the
free 6 years guarantee that Richer Sounds advertised.

We've had an occasional problem. A couple of times it went
into hibernation mode while we were watching. It forgets the
subtitle setting - it turns it off. We get this about once a
week It turns on the audio description, maybe once a month. I
find the font used in the programme info too small. I can't
find a quick way to locate channels. Forwarding/Rewind works
like a Sky box now. Foxsat allowed one to step forward in user
defined time steps. We've had a couple of programmes that
didn;t record, but I think it was because there was a clash. I
miss not being able to see which channels are being recorded,
without having to go via the menu to recorded programmes.

Most of those reviews for the HDR 1100S were positive but a
non-trivial number of people gave very negative reviews based
on some nasty sounding problems.

apart from the restart problem that I mentioned, none of the
issues with my, what is actually the 1010s is a bug

they are just annoyances.

It takes more key presses to do a particular task than the 9150
takes. Sometimes considerably more.

Martin mentioned the problem with displaying the current live
recordings (something which you might wish to do to stop the
recording early)

there are a dozen other little things like that

tim


What about those problems on the HDR-1000S I picked out from an
Amazon review? Have they been fixed or maybe they were sorted out for
the HDR-1100S?

I mean these: no bookmarking, slow channel changes,


not really slow.

no
slow-motion playback, unfriendly menus,


Unfriendly = not the same as before. There's no real problem with the
menus once
you know how to use the box.

doesn't record if you
press record mid-program.


The complaint was that it didn' record the whole programme.Not that it
doesn't
record. If the programme started in the last 30 minutes it records the
whole
programme.


Ah

This will be reliant on having the "live" buffer set to ON (and, of course,
on you watching that program before you pressed record).

I have that turned off because Hummy have the annoying feature of
prioritising the live buffer over adding padding to overlapping recordings.

Now that I have turned this off, I can't find the menu option for turning it
back on again (not that I want to).


Maybe it's not obvious, but the current software in the STB is the same
as in
the PVR.

We have three generations of Humax boxes

Dutch cable
Foxsat
Current

All three are utterly different. It's hard to believe the software and
user
interface are from the same factory.


Well the UI of the Cable company will be decided by them.

When in Belgium I had a Belgian cable box and its UI was useless.

For one, despite this being a multilingual country it wasn't language
selectable, giving me Dutch only (I could have lived with French).

and then had the annoying feature of always adding padding to the saved
recording time (rather than just trying to start early/end late at the time
of making the recording).

This meant that if you tried to record back to back programs it would tell
you there was a clash and you had to go and manually edit the recording
time(s).

All in Dutch, a right PITA that was

tim












--

Martin in Zuid Holland






  #13  
Old November 16th 16, 09:52 AM posted to uk.tech.digital-tv
tim...[_2_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 319
Default Freesat+ EPG


"Martin" wrote in message
...
On Tue, 15 Nov 2016 17:42:46 GMT, pamela wrote:

On 09:28 15 Nov 2016, tim... wrote:


"pamela" wrote in message
...
On 11:30 14 Nov 2016, tim... wrote:


"Martin" wrote in message
...
On Sun, 13 Nov 2016 10:44:26 GMT, pamela
wrote:

On 09:49 13 Nov 2016, Martin wrote:

On Sat, 12 Nov 2016 18:06:50 +0000, MikeS
wrote:

Does anyone know where to find an authoritative explanation
of how the Freesat+ EPG operates? I have long assumed that
the EPG data is broadcast by satellite and has links to
either the live satellite channels or the Internet URLs for
the various servers supplying on demand and catchup
services.

Recently someone claimed on the Digital Spy forums that
"the on demand services are provided by Freesat's own
servers. It used to be called Freetime but they changed the
name to Freesat Smart +." His evidence for this is a link
to http://www.freesat.co.uk/what-is-freesat but that simply
talks about the on demand services available from the EPG.

To me his claim seems to be nonsense but for once Google is
unable to find any explanation of how the EPG functions.

I have one Humax box that gets the EPG directly from a
satellite and another that gets it via Internet.

Is that the Humax 5600S?

No.The former is a Humax HDR 1100S 1 TB PVR, the latter is a
Humax HB1000S STB

I hope they fixed the "bugs" when releasing the latter.

I have the former and have discovered that there is an
increased number of "restart" [1] glitches when it is
connected to the internet, than when it isn't.

Annoyingly, it's impossible to disconnect the 1100S from wi-fi
once you have connected it (it is hard coded to "always
connect"), other than by disabling the router, which is a PITA
as it means that I can't then connect my laptop.

I had to reset to factory defaults to lose the password, to
stop it connecting (attempting to connect with an incorrect
password failed to reset the saved one). Now I can't use
catch up on my box (fortunately I don't use that feature much)

Of course, should I report this fault I expect to get the
normal "couldn't care less" response from Hummy, so I wont
bother.

tim

[1] further information available if required

The list of bugs and design flaws of the flagship satellite
recievers from Humax makes my head spin. I was once keen to
get one but a sizeable minority of purchasers were complaining
bitterly about certain aspects that I put off buying one until
these problems had been shaken out. With Humax it seems this
never actually happens.


The list of features that my 9150 FreeView box has, that the
next generation FreeSat box is missing, is endless.


Snap! I was brought up on a Humax 9150T Freeview receiver and
generally it was just fine.

A lot of Freeview is SD, which I don't like, so I wanted to
receive satellite for a higher res picture but there aren't many
full function receivers like the Humax 1100S which turns out to be
a disappointment for many people.


The majority give it 5 stars


Whilst they do seem to have the best hardware in class (I have
experience of two other manufactures which are rubbish by
comparison), if I were a senior SW engineer at Hummy working on
the GUI (that is my specialisation) I would be embarrassed at
the product I had delivered.


Isn't this one of the things the old Nokia company struggled with.
It rushed out buggy models and then tried to patch the worst
problems after they had been sold.


It looks to me as if Humax contract out their software. Why else would
each
generation of hardware have totally different software?



to keep their UI team busy

if you just reuse the one that you have that team will not be needed on the
next gen product

It's why companies continually revamp their websites

tim



  #14  
Old November 16th 16, 09:54 AM posted to uk.tech.digital-tv
tim...[_2_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 319
Default Freesat+ EPG


"pamela" wrote in message
...
On 22:20 15 Nov 2016, Martin wrote:

On Tue, 15 Nov 2016 17:42:46 GMT, pamela
wrote:

I get the impression that there are several versions of a given
Humax model with minor hardware variations which no doubt
interact with their software fixes such that not everyone gets a
particular bug fixed.

It's far too complex for tv viewers who simply want a "sit back
and watch" experience not a "keep patching and hope for the
best" experience.


Neither my wife nor I have problems using it despite the useless
manual.


I didn't mean the usability of the controls but the whole ownership
experience!


It has some annoying UI features

But it is faultless at actually making the recordings that it is asked to
make

previous PVRs that I have owned have not been so reliable.

That is a killer feature for me. It trumps everything else

tim




  #15  
Old November 16th 16, 06:47 PM posted to uk.tech.digital-tv
Dickie mint[_2_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 243
Default Freesat+ EPG

On 14/11/2016 20:50, Andy Burns wrote:
MikeS wrote:

Does anyone know where to find an authoritative explanation of how the
Freesat+ EPG operates?


Isn't it just in the SI tables?

https://www.dvb.org/resources/public/standards/a38_dvb-si_specification.pdf



Can you hear the gear wheels cranking round in my head?! It was 2004
when I retired from things digital!

I'm not aware of any easy to read guide on how STBs use the SI and
convert the tabled information.

IIRC the EITpf (Event Information Table present/following) is the now &
next information and EITsched (Event Information Table schedule)
contains the 7 day programme information. For each channel. Carried in
the SI (Service Information) stream on each multiplex. Also carried are
EITs for other channels on other muxes. The specs require minimum times
for these to be repeated. 'Other' tables are slower in a mux. Which is
why it's best to change to a channel in another mux to get them quicker.

If you want to get off to sleep quickly tonight read the specs!

Richard
  #16  
Old November 16th 16, 07:52 PM posted to uk.tech.digital-tv
MikeS
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 3
Default Freesat+ EPG

On 16/11/2016 19:47, Dickie mint wrote:
On 14/11/2016 20:50, Andy Burns wrote:
MikeS wrote:

Does anyone know where to find an authoritative explanation of how the
Freesat+ EPG operates?


Isn't it just in the SI tables?

https://www.dvb.org/resources/public/standards/a38_dvb-si_specification.pdf




Can you hear the gear wheels cranking round in my head?! It was 2004
when I retired from things digital!

I'm not aware of any easy to read guide on how STBs use the SI and
convert the tabled information.

IIRC the EITpf (Event Information Table present/following) is the now &
next information and EITsched (Event Information Table schedule)
contains the 7 day programme information. For each channel. Carried in
the SI (Service Information) stream on each multiplex. Also carried are
EITs for other channels on other muxes. The specs require minimum times
for these to be repeated. 'Other' tables are slower in a mux. Which is
why it's best to change to a channel in another mux to get them quicker.

If you want to get off to sleep quickly tonight read the specs!

Richard


Very true. I looked at the SI tables pdf linked by Andy Burns but could
not even work out if any of the EIT descriptions actually refer to
storage of GUI text.

Both of you seem to be saying that the live channel GUI information is
broadcast which is what I thought. That leaves the on demand Freeplay
etc question. Is the GUI data for that broadcast separately or obtained
via the Internet? If the latter is Freesat running the GUI server?

  #17  
Old November 17th 16, 03:11 PM posted to uk.tech.digital-tv
Dickie mint[_2_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 243
Default Freesat+ EPG

On 16/11/2016 20:52, MikeS wrote:

Very true. I looked at the SI tables pdf linked by Andy Burns but could
not even work out if any of the EIT descriptions actually refer to
storage of GUI text.

Both of you seem to be saying that the live channel GUI information is
broadcast which is what I thought. That leaves the on demand Freeplay
etc question. Is the GUI data for that broadcast separately or obtained
via the Internet? If the latter is Freesat running the GUI server?


Ondemand (e.g. iplayer) has to be in the iplayer stream. It cannot be
broadcast in the Freesat or Freeview multiplexes. AFAIA the specs do
not even cover it. And there are timing issues. Plus the amount of data
would not allow for the EITs to be repeated at the specified rates.
And as ondemand is virtually synonymous with Broadband?

The BBC R & D website has a lot of stuff, but takes some wading through.

My job in the beeb was to manage to maintenance of the kit in the
English Regions. I needed to understand what it was doing from that
perspective. But the much deeper workings I left to R & D bods!

One of those brilliant guys used to be on these groups......

Richard
 




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