A Sky, cable and digital tv forum. Digital TV Banter

If this is your first visit, be sure to check out the FAQ by clicking the link above. You may have to register before you can post: click the register link above to proceed. To start viewing messages, select the forum that you want to visit from the selection below.

Go Back   Home » Digital TV Banter forum » Digital TV Newsgroups » uk.tech.digital-tv (Digital TV - General)
Site Map Home Register Authors List Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read Web Partners

uk.tech.digital-tv (Digital TV - General) (uk.tech.digital-tv) Discussion of all matters technical in origin related to the reception of digital television transmissions, be they via satellite, terrestrial or cable. Advertising is forbidden, with no exceptions.

with regard to tv licence



 
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #11  
Old September 4th 16, 12:21 PM posted to uk.tech.digital-tv
Max Demian
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 3,700
Default with regard to tv licence

On Sun, 04 Sep 2016 13:55:59 +0200, Martin wrote:
On Sun, 4 Sep 2016 03:50:18 -0700 (PDT), "R. Mark Clayton"
wrote:
On Sunday, 4 September 2016 11:23:18 UTC+1, Brian Gaff wrote:


On the bbc I player it seems a bit pointless to just ask if you

have a
licence and ticking yes allows you to watch stuff. Who is going

to click no,
honestly?


Er someone over 75?
Someone under 16.
Anyone under 10.
Diplomats.
Someone (e.g. a foreigner) staying in a hotel.


A student with a battery powered TV.


What about while it's being charged from the mains?

--
Max Demian
  #12  
Old September 4th 16, 12:49 PM posted to uk.tech.digital-tv
Indy Jess John
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 1,015
Default with regard to tv licence

On 04/09/2016 12:27, Roderick Stewart wrote:
On Sun, 4 Sep 2016 12:07:55 +0100, wrote:

People over 75 are not exempt from the legislation on TV licences. They
just have the option of a free licence.


Doesn't that make them exempt from the *relevance* of the legislation,
which in practice amounts to the same thing?


They are not exempt. What age 75 brings is the *opportunity* to request
a free licence. If they don't apply for a free licence then they have
to pay.

Jim
  #13  
Old September 4th 16, 12:59 PM posted to uk.tech.digital-tv
Roderick Stewart[_3_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 1,966
Default with regard to tv licence

On Sun, 04 Sep 2016 13:49:01 +0100, Indy Jess John
wrote:

People over 75 are not exempt from the legislation on TV licences. They
just have the option of a free licence.


Doesn't that make them exempt from the *relevance* of the legislation,
which in practice amounts to the same thing?


They are not exempt. What age 75 brings is the *opportunity* to request
a free licence. If they don't apply for a free licence then they have
to pay.


Hmm. I don't yet have that opportunity, but I wonder how I'll make
this difficult choice - pay for a licence or not pay for a licence?

Rod.
  #14  
Old September 4th 16, 01:02 PM posted to uk.tech.digital-tv
Roderick Stewart[_3_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 1,966
Default with regard to tv licence

On Sun, 04 Sep 2016 13:21:01 +0100, Max Demian
wrote:

On the bbc I player it seems a bit pointless to just ask if you

have a
licence and ticking yes allows you to watch stuff. Who is going

to click no,
honestly?


Er someone over 75?
Someone under 16.
Anyone under 10.
Diplomats.
Someone (e.g. a foreigner) staying in a hotel.


A student with a battery powered TV.


What about while it's being charged from the mains?


Good point. Even while a laptop is connected to the mains via its
power supply, it's actually running from the battery. The power supply
isn't directly powering the laptop. I daresay it'll all boil down to
exact wording, if they've thought of this situation.

Rod.
  #15  
Old September 4th 16, 01:09 PM posted to uk.tech.digital-tv
Robin[_8_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 385
Default with regard to tv licence

On 04/09/2016 12:37, R. Mark Clayton wrote:
On Sunday, 4 September 2016 12:08:02 UTC+1, Robin wrote:
On 04/09/2016 11:50, R. Mark Clayton wrote:
On Sunday, 4 September 2016 11:23:18 UTC+1, Brian Gaff wrote:
On the bbc I player it seems a bit pointless to just ask if you have a
licence and ticking yes allows you to watch stuff. Who is going to click no,
honestly?
Brian

--
----- -
This newsgroup posting comes to you directly from...
The Sofa of Brian Gaff...

Blind user, so no pictures please!

Er someone over 75?

People over 75 are not exempt from the legislation on TV licences. They
just have the option of a free licence.

Diplomats.


Diplomats are not exempt but the licensing law cannot be enforced
against them. (And I can't see why you think TV licensing might be any
different from - say - speeding or rape.)


Because it applies to premises, not personal conduct outside the mission.


A licence *covers* premises[1] but it is *issued* to a person and the
relevant *offences* are committed by a person. So I don't see where the
diplomatic status of premises come into it. See s.361 Communications
Act 2003 (Licence required for use of TV receiver):

"(1) A television receiver must not be installed or used unless the
installation and use of the receiver is authorised by a licence under
this Part.

(2) A person who installs or uses a television receiver in contravention
of subsection (1) is guilty of an offence.

(3) A person with a television receiver in his possession or under his
control who—

(a) intends to install or use it in contravention of subsection (1), or

(b) knows, or has reasonable grounds for believing, that another person
intends to install or use it in contravention of that subsection,

is guilty of an offence. "

So eg people without diplomatic immunity - eg visitors and employees
such as cleaners - are not free to argue they are immune while in a
mission.


[1] broadly speaking. Eg not so simple if the "premises" comprise or
contain accommodation for residential care with multiple rooms/flats/etc



I suppose the BBC could say they can't do it because embassies are legally viewed as foreign territory.


I doubt very much the BBC would say any such thing. Apart from anything
else, it's a myth that embassies are treated as foreign territory. They
remain the territory of the host state. It's the Vienna Convention
which governs what can and can't be done.



--
Robin
reply-to address is (intended to be) valid




--
Robin
reply-to address is (intended to be) valid
  #16  
Old September 4th 16, 02:16 PM posted to uk.tech.digital-tv
Jim Lesurf[_2_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 4,138
Default with regard to tv licence

In article , Robin
wrote:

I doubt very much the BBC would say any such thing. Apart from anything
else, it's a myth that embassies are treated as foreign territory. They
remain the territory of the host state. It's the Vienna Convention
which governs what can and can't be done.


So why has Assange not been removed from the embassy in which he is
currently residing?

Also, it occurs to me that the international conventions may well deal with
radio traffic in or out of Embassies because in the past they used radio to
try and have secure and independent ways to exchange info with their home
country.

Raising these points because I *don't* know how they might or might not be
relevant here.

However I presume if the main embassy staff can't be proscuted for UK
offences, none of them could be required to pay for a TV licence, or be
made to stop watching the BBC inside the embassy. Hence any more detailed
argument may be akin to arguing how many angels can dance on the head of a
pin! :-)

Jim

--
Please use the address on the audiomisc page if you wish to email me.
Electronics http://www.st-and.ac.uk/~www_pa/Scot...o/electron.htm
Armstrong Audio http://www.audiomisc.co.uk/Armstrong/armstrong.html
Audio Misc http://www.audiomisc.co.uk/index.html

  #17  
Old September 4th 16, 03:02 PM posted to uk.tech.digital-tv
NY
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 1,005
Default with regard to tv licence

"Robin" wrote in message
...
A licence *covers* premises[1] but it is *issued* to a person and the
relevant *offences* are committed by a person.


Leaving aside diplomatic premises, what is the situation if you have a TV
licence that applies to your house, and you take a laptop/tablet away on
holiday with you and watch a) programmes that you recorded while you were at
home, and b) programmes that you download or receive by TV aerial while you
are away from home? I imagine this applies a lot to people who have a
touring caravan.

Can you said to be covered by the TV licence of the premises where you are
staying, if it is a hotel of B&B? Does the TV licensing system cater for
people who travel around, either as part of their lifestyle or for
occasional holidays?

  #18  
Old September 4th 16, 03:13 PM posted to uk.tech.digital-tv
Robin[_8_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 385
Default with regard to tv licence

On 04/09/2016 15:21, Martin wrote:
snip


The territory of International Agencies is definitely not part of the host
country.


If by that you mean by that that *some* international agencies occupy
*some* areas which have special status separate from the host country
then yes. Eg the UN HQ in New York. But note that that does not mean
it is not part of the USA, NY State and NY City for many purposes. See
eg
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_Nations_Headquarters#International_characte r

But may I point out that I was replying to and explicitly commenting on
the status of embassies? If you wish to argue those are not on the
territory of the host state do please cite your interpretation of the
Vienna Convention or other law to support it.

And please explain how it works with embassies such as the Ecuadorean
one in London which is a first floor flat. I know English law
recognises a "flying freehold" but does international law recognise
"flying territory"?


Senior staff have diplomatic immunity and other staff can only be
prosecuted with the Director General's agreement.


If you are referring to the UN then

a. my understanding was that immunity stems not from the
extraterritorial nature of the site but from the Convention on the
Privileges and Immunities of the United Nation but

b. I'll leave you to edit the Wikipedia entry above which states that
only "a few members of the UN staff" have immunity from prosecution:

"The site of the UN headquarters has extraterritoriality status.[22]
This affects some law enforcement where UN rules override the laws of
New York City, but it does not give immunity to those who commit crimes
there. In addition, the United Nations Headquarters remains under the
jurisdiction and laws of the United States, although a few members of
the UN staff have diplomatic immunity and so cannot be prosecuted by
local courts unless the diplomatic immunity is waived by the
Secretary-General. In 2005, Secretary-General Kofi Annan waived the
immunity of Benon Sevan, Aleksandr Yakovlev, and Vladimir Kuznetsov in
relation to the Oil-for-Food Programme,[23] and all were charged in the
United States District Court for the Southern District of New York.
Benon Sevan later fled the United States to Cyprus, while Aleksandr
Yakovlev and Vladimir Kuznetsov decided to stand trial.[24]"

There are of course many others at the UN who have diplomatic immunity
under the Vienna Convention.



--
Robin
reply-to address is (intended to be) valid
  #19  
Old September 4th 16, 03:17 PM posted to uk.tech.digital-tv
Bill Wright[_3_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 1,622
Default with regard to tv licence

On 04/09/2016 14:02, Roderick Stewart wrote:

Good point. Even while a laptop is connected to the mains via its
power supply, it's actually running from the battery. The power supply
isn't directly powering the laptop.


If the battery is flat and you disconnect the mains the telly will
switch off. In what way is it not powered from the mains?

By your logic anything running from a transformer is powered by the
secondary winding and not by the mains.

Humbug sir! Humbug!

Bill

  #20  
Old September 4th 16, 03:19 PM posted to uk.tech.digital-tv
Robin[_8_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 385
Default with regard to tv licence

On 04/09/2016 15:16, Jim Lesurf wrote:
In article , Robin
wrote:

I doubt very much the BBC would say any such thing. Apart from anything
else, it's a myth that embassies are treated as foreign territory. They
remain the territory of the host state. It's the Vienna Convention
which governs what can and can't be done.


So why has Assange not been removed from the embassy in which he is
currently residing?


Because of the Vienna Convention I have already cited. Specifically
Article 22 which provides that the premises of a diplomatic mission must
not be entered by the host country except by permission of the head of
the mission. But that does not make them part of the foreign country.
It really, really, doesn't.


Also, it occurs to me that the international conventions may well deal with
radio traffic in or out of Embassies because in the past they used radio to
try and have secure and independent ways to exchange info with their home
country.

Raising these points because I *don't* know how they might or might not be
relevant here.

However I presume if the main embassy staff can't be proscuted for UK
offences, none of them could be required to pay for a TV licence, or be
made to stop watching the BBC inside the embassy. Hence any more detailed
argument may be akin to arguing how many angels can dance on the head of a
pin! :-)


Yes - save for my point about staff without immunity watching TV in the
embassy. Though I suspect even those on performance targets for
unlicensed viewing might decide that pursuing them would be unwise as
they can't gain entry uninvited; and IIRC "detector vans" would be a
breach of the Convention
--
Robin
reply-to address is (intended to be) valid
 




Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

vB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump


All times are GMT. The time now is 05:44 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.6.4
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.SEO by vBSEO 2.4.0
Copyright 2004-2017 Digital TV Banter.
The comments are property of their posters.