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TOT2: modern education, cultural differences, and Goethe



 
 
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  #11  
Old January 1st 15, 02:28 AM posted to uk.tech.digital-tv
Bill Wright[_2_]
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Posts: 9,381
Default TOT2: modern education, cultural differences, and Goethe

Another John wrote:

He read up on it, OK.
He wrote his stuff, OK
He then asked his Grandpa(?) to help him, and Grandpa carefully goes
through it all, improving it... to the point where it looks like
someone else (perhaps Wikipedia) wrote it. Surely at this point your
argument breaks down? It's NOT his original work!


No, there's a difference between doing the work for the child and gently
helping the child improve his own work. That, actually, is what teaching
is. It's a difficult art, but a good teacher can draw out of the child
better work than the child would do alone, without telling the child
what to put. Basically it's a matter of saying, "Now that bit isn't
clear. Can you think of a different way to express it?" Or "You haven't
mentioned something important." I don't think it breaks any rules to
suggest a word, if that word is 'on the edge' of the child's vocab.


Not that he is alone: I'm sure many, many parents and grandparents help
their kids to do their homework, thus upsetting the natural balance of
grading in class.[1]


As I said, there's helping and there's teaching. The other thing is, the
child should be told to say, if asked, "Yes I was helped." And if the
teacher wants to discuss it they can.

The mere fact of 'helping' shows that adults in the family take homework
seriously, and that has obvious benefits.

When it comes to literacy I think parental help is vital. Just hear them
read, and help with hard words if necessary. I don't mean just tell them
the word: get them to look and say where the word allows it, or even get
a clue from the context.


OTOH, it can be argued that helping kids do their homework is genuinely
improving their understanding and their self-expression, and is an
excellent form of tutoring.


You can't beat one-to-one.


Don't answer until you're ****ed again Bill.


I've been drinking slowly but without hesitation or deviation since 9pm
and it's now 3.25am.

Bill
  #12  
Old January 1st 15, 09:01 AM posted to uk.tech.digital-tv
Jim Lesurf[_2_]
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Posts: 4,164
Default TOT2: modern education, cultural differences, and Goethe

In article , Bill Wright
wrote:
Another John wrote:


He read up on it, OK.
He wrote his stuff, OK
He then asked his Grandpa(?) to help him, and Grandpa carefully goes
through it all, improving it... to the point where it looks like
someone else (perhaps Wikipedia) wrote it. Surely at this point your
argument breaks down? It's NOT his original work!


No, there's a difference between doing the work for the child and gently
helping the child improve his own work. That, actually, is what teaching
is. It's a difficult art, but a good teacher can draw out of the child
better work than the child would do alone, without telling the child
what to put. Basically it's a matter of saying, "Now that bit isn't
clear. Can you think of a different way to express it?" Or "You haven't
mentioned something important." I don't think it breaks any rules to
suggest a word, if that word is 'on the edge' of the child's vocab.


FWIW I'd agree.


As I said, there's helping and there's teaching. The other thing is, the
child should be told to say, if asked, "Yes I was helped." And if the
teacher wants to discuss it they can.


If in doubt, the best course is for the parent/helper to discuss such
matters as the level of help with the teachers. I'd expect most teachers
would welcome help from involved parents. As you say, its not the same as
simply doing the work for the pupil. Matter of judgement to decide the
borderline.

Jim

--
Please use the address on the audiomisc page if you wish to email me.
Electronics http://www.st-and.ac.uk/~www_pa/Scot...o/electron.htm
Armstrong Audio http://www.audiomisc.co.uk/Armstrong/armstrong.html
Audio Misc http://www.audiomisc.co.uk/index.html

  #13  
Old January 1st 15, 04:39 PM posted to uk.tech.digital-tv
Bill Wright[_2_]
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Posts: 9,381
Default TOT2: modern education, cultural differences, and Goethe

Jim Lesurf wrote:

If in doubt, the best course is for the parent/helper to discuss such
matters as the level of help with the teachers. I'd expect most teachers
would welcome help from involved parents. As you say, its not the same as
simply doing the work for the pupil. Matter of judgement to decide the
borderline.


Zacly.

By the way, I must oil this chair. It's driving me mad.

Bill
  #14  
Old January 1st 15, 06:59 PM posted to uk.tech.digital-tv
Max Demian
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Posts: 3,781
Default TOT2: modern education, cultural differences, and Goethe

"Wolfgang Schwanke" wrote in message
...
Martin wrote in
:

My English teacher taught us to pronounce Goethe as gee-thee when
speaking English.


and Braun as Brawn?


That, and vokes-waggon.


Can you cope with Nietzsche (or even spell it)?

Clue: it rhymes with a common English word.

--
Max Demian


  #15  
Old January 2nd 15, 12:25 AM posted to uk.tech.digital-tv
Paul Ratcliffe
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Posts: 2,451
Default TOT2: modern education, cultural differences, and Goethe

On Thu, 01 Jan 2015 03:28:01 +0000, Bill Wright wrote:

I've been drinking slowly but without hesitation or deviation since 9pm
and it's now 3.25am.


You seem to be managing repetition OK though...
  #16  
Old January 2nd 15, 02:00 AM posted to uk.tech.digital-tv
Bill Wright[_2_]
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Posts: 9,381
Default TOT2: modern education, cultural differences, and Goethe

Paul Ratcliffe wrote:
On Thu, 01 Jan 2015 03:28:01 +0000, Bill Wright wrote:

I've been drinking slowly but without hesitation or deviation since 9pm
and it's now 3.25am.


You seem to be managing repetition OK though...


Like I said. I don't want to repeat the point.

Oh! I just moved a fraction and there was a terrible squeak! I don't
know what I'm going to do.

Bill
  #17  
Old January 2nd 15, 07:51 AM posted to uk.tech.digital-tv
Indy Jess John
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Posts: 1,179
Default TOT2: modern education, cultural differences, and Goethe

On 01/01/2015 19:59, Max Demian wrote:

Can you cope with Nietzsche (or even spell it)?

Clue: it rhymes with a common English word.

I rhyme it with teacher.
I couldn't care less if that is right or not.

Jim

  #18  
Old January 2nd 15, 01:24 PM posted to uk.tech.digital-tv
Bill Wright[_2_]
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Posts: 9,381
Default TOT2: modern education, cultural differences, and Goethe

Indy Jess John wrote:
On 01/01/2015 19:59, Max Demian wrote:

Can you cope with Nietzsche (or even spell it)?

Clue: it rhymes with a common English word.

I rhyme it with teacher.
I couldn't care less if that is right or not.

Jim


How often do you use the word? I use the word 'squeak' a lot, and I make
it rhyme with 'leak'.

Bill
  #19  
Old January 2nd 15, 01:31 PM posted to uk.tech.digital-tv
Indy Jess John
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Posts: 1,179
Default TOT2: modern education, cultural differences, and Goethe

On 02/01/2015 14:24, Bill Wright wrote:
Indy Jess John wrote:
On 01/01/2015 19:59, Max Demian wrote:

Can you cope with Nietzsche (or even spell it)?

Clue: it rhymes with a common English word.

I rhyme it with teacher.
I couldn't care less if that is right or not.

Jim


How often do you use the word? I use the word 'squeak' a lot, and I make
it rhyme with 'leak'.

Bill


Oil remember that
:-)

Jim

  #20  
Old January 2nd 15, 10:20 PM posted to uk.tech.digital-tv
Max Demian
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Posts: 3,781
Default TOT2: modern education, cultural differences, and Goethe

"Wolfgang Schwanke" wrote in message
...
"Max Demian"
wrote in :

Can you cope with Nietzsche (or even spell it)?

Clue: it rhymes with a common English word.


"quiche, sir"?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Eax5EfFbZGw


Real men don't eat quiche.

--
Max Demian


 




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