Peter Duncanson wrote:

I cannot comprehend how these laws came into existence unless there was
some serious lobbying and maybe a few incentives to the lawmakers of the
times? How many times can you charge for the same good/service?

There are NOT charging more than once for the same good/service.

In the case of a radio playing to a 'public' audience, they are. The
radio station has already paid them the same fees, based upon that
station's audience size. In the case of a BBC radio station, they've
been paid with *our* money.

Sorry, but the PRS/PPL are just a bunch of 'jobsworth fleece yer money
agents'. Come the revolution they'll be second up against the wall
(first will be Ofcom of course).

On 07/07/2010 06:16, Brian Gaff wrote:
So what about all those music quizzes and sing along in day centres, blind
clubs etc all over the country. is there a roving team of undercover folk
employed by these organisations looking for victims, erm people doing this
illegally?

Brian


Would they be protected under fair usage? Not that there is anything
fair about PRS & PPL extortion.

Here is a great video:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CJn_jC4FNDo

In article ,
Brian Gaff wrote:
So what about all those music quizzes and sing along in day centres,
blind clubs etc all over the country. is there a roving team of
undercover folk employed by these organisations looking for victims,
erm people doing this illegally?

Does it make a difference if it's being done by a commercial organisation
with public access?

--
*If your feet smell and your nose runs, you're built upside down.

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

"Mark Carver" wrote in message
...
Peter Duncanson wrote:

I cannot comprehend how these laws came into existence unless there was
some serious lobbying and maybe a few incentives to the lawmakers of the
times? How many times can you charge for the same good/service?

There are NOT charging more than once for the same good/service.

In the case of a radio playing to a 'public' audience, they are. The radio
station has already paid them the same fees, based upon that station's
audience size. In the case of a BBC radio station, they've been paid with
*our* money.

Sorry, but the PRS/PPL are just a bunch of 'jobsworth fleece yer money
agents'. Come the revolution they'll be second up against the wall (first
will be Ofcom of course).



I think we're going to need a bigger wall...

On Wed, 07 Jul 2010 08:58:34 +0100, Mark Carver
wrote:

Peter Duncanson wrote:

I cannot comprehend how these laws came into existence unless there was
some serious lobbying and maybe a few incentives to the lawmakers of the
times? How many times can you charge for the same good/service?

There are NOT charging more than once for the same good/service.

In the case of a radio playing to a 'public' audience, they are. The
radio station has already paid them the same fees, based upon that
station's audience size. In the case of a BBC radio station, they've
been paid with *our* money.

Sorry, but the PRS/PPL are just a bunch of 'jobsworth fleece yer money
agents'. Come the revolution they'll be second up against the wall
(first will be Ofcom of course).

I don't want to be up against the wall with PRS/PPL(!) but a radio
station's audience size does not include the additional listeners beyond
individuals and families.

--
Peter Duncanson
(in uk.tech.digital-tv)

On Wed, 07 Jul 2010 10:51:03 +0100, Lucky13
wrote:

On 07/07/2010 06:16, Brian Gaff wrote:
So what about all those music quizzes and sing along in day centres, blind
clubs etc all over the country. is there a roving team of undercover folk
employed by these organisations looking for victims, erm people doing this
illegally?

Brian


Would they be protected under fair usage? Not that there is anything
fair about PRS & PPL extortion.

Here is a great video:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CJn_jC4FNDo

I assume though that US copyright law is not exactly the same as ours?
--
(\__/) M.
(='.'=) Due to the amount of spam posted via googlegroups and
(")_(") their inaction to the problem. I am blocking some articles
posted from there. If you wish your postings to be seen by
everyone you will need use a different method of posting.

Peter Duncanson wrote:
On Wed, 07 Jul 2010 08:58:34 +0100, Mark Carver

Sorry, but the PRS/PPL are just a bunch of 'jobsworth fleece yer money
agents'. Come the revolution they'll be second up against the wall
(first will be Ofcom of course).

I don't want to be up against the wall with PRS/PPL(!)

Don't worry Peter, you'll be safe.

but a radio
station's audience size does not include the additional listeners beyond
individuals and families.

I'm not sure how the payment calculations are made, but I think
potential audience has a weighting, so for instance the difference that
Radio 2 and 3 would pay for the same piece of music would not differ
'pro rata' in terms of their actual audience figures ?

In any case, how do you prove one way or another that those being
'performed to' in a work place or shop are not listeners to the same
radio station anyway ?

"Lucky13" wrote in message
...
On 07/07/2010 06:16, Brian Gaff wrote:
So what about all those music quizzes and sing along in day centres,
blind
clubs etc all over the country. is there a roving team of undercover folk
employed by these organisations looking for victims, erm people doing
this
illegally?

Brian


Would they be protected under fair usage?

Even if you would, playing a radio in a shop and broadcasting to a couple of
hundred people who walk though is not by any stretch of the imagination,
"fair usage".

tim

Peter Duncanson writes:

I don't want to be up against the wall with PRS/PPL(!) but a radio
station's audience size does not include the additional listeners beyond
individuals and families.

Sorry but that does not compute! By definition anyone listening to the
radio station is part of the audience therefore the audience size, at
any one time, is the total number of people who are listening, by
whatever means, to the station. It is not the number of loudspeakers and
headphones out of which the station's output is being played.

On 07/07/2010 12:42, tim.... wrote:
wrote in message
...
On 07/07/2010 06:16, Brian Gaff wrote:
So what about all those music quizzes and sing along in day centres,
blind
clubs etc all over the country. is there a roving team of undercover folk
employed by these organisations looking for victims, erm people doing
this
illegally?

Brian


Would they be protected under fair usage?

Even if you would, playing a radio in a shop and broadcasting to a couple of
hundred people who walk though is not by any stretch of the imagination,
"fair usage".

tim



Sorry I was applying fair usage primarily to music quizzes in pubs.